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<head><meta charset="utf-8"><title>planning meeting 2019.01.03 · t-compiler · Zulip Chat Archive</title></head>
<h2>Stream: <a href="https://rust-lang.github.io/zulip_archive/stream/131828-t-compiler/index.html">t-compiler</a></h2>
<h3>Topic: <a href="https://rust-lang.github.io/zulip_archive/stream/131828-t-compiler/topic/planning.20meeting.202019.2E01.2E03.html">planning meeting 2019.01.03</a></h3>

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<a name="184739377"></a>
<h4><a href="https://rust-lang.zulipchat.com#narrow/stream/131828-t-compiler/topic/planning%20meeting%202019.01.03/near/184739377" class="zl"><img src="https://rust-lang.github.io/zulip_archive/assets/img/zulip.svg" alt="view this post on Zulip" style="width:20px;height:20px;"></a> nikomatsakis <a href="https://rust-lang.github.io/zulip_archive/stream/131828-t-compiler/topic/planning.20meeting.202019.2E01.2E03.html#184739377">(Jan 03 2020 at 14:57)</a>:</h4>
<p>Hey <span class="user-group-mention" data-user-group-id="897">@T-compiler/meeting</span> -- planning meeting in a few minutes. Last change to open any meeting proposals for the next few weeks. =)</p>



<a name="184739984"></a>
<h4><a href="https://rust-lang.zulipchat.com#narrow/stream/131828-t-compiler/topic/planning%20meeting%202019.01.03/near/184739984" class="zl"><img src="https://rust-lang.github.io/zulip_archive/assets/img/zulip.svg" alt="view this post on Zulip" style="width:20px;height:20px;"></a> nikomatsakis <a href="https://rust-lang.github.io/zulip_archive/stream/131828-t-compiler/topic/planning.20meeting.202019.2E01.2E03.html#184739984">(Jan 03 2020 at 15:03)</a>:</h4>
<h1>Announcements</h1>



<a name="184739992"></a>
<h4><a href="https://rust-lang.zulipchat.com#narrow/stream/131828-t-compiler/topic/planning%20meeting%202019.01.03/near/184739992" class="zl"><img src="https://rust-lang.github.io/zulip_archive/assets/img/zulip.svg" alt="view this post on Zulip" style="width:20px;height:20px;"></a> nikomatsakis <a href="https://rust-lang.github.io/zulip_archive/stream/131828-t-compiler/topic/planning.20meeting.202019.2E01.2E03.html#184739992">(Jan 03 2020 at 15:03)</a>:</h4>
<p>Hey <span class="user-group-mention" data-user-group-id="897">@T-compiler/meeting</span>, planning meeting starting now</p>



<a name="184740091"></a>
<h4><a href="https://rust-lang.zulipchat.com#narrow/stream/131828-t-compiler/topic/planning%20meeting%202019.01.03/near/184740091" class="zl"><img src="https://rust-lang.github.io/zulip_archive/assets/img/zulip.svg" alt="view this post on Zulip" style="width:20px;height:20px;"></a> nikomatsakis <a href="https://rust-lang.github.io/zulip_archive/stream/131828-t-compiler/topic/planning.20meeting.202019.2E01.2E03.html#184740091">(Jan 03 2020 at 15:04)</a>:</h4>
<p>I don't have any announcements since yesterday I don't thnk :)</p>



<a name="184740098"></a>
<h4><a href="https://rust-lang.zulipchat.com#narrow/stream/131828-t-compiler/topic/planning%20meeting%202019.01.03/near/184740098" class="zl"><img src="https://rust-lang.github.io/zulip_archive/assets/img/zulip.svg" alt="view this post on Zulip" style="width:20px;height:20px;"></a> nikomatsakis <a href="https://rust-lang.github.io/zulip_archive/stream/131828-t-compiler/topic/planning.20meeting.202019.2E01.2E03.html#184740098">(Jan 03 2020 at 15:04)</a>:</h4>
<p>I guess we might as well get started?</p>



<a name="184740115"></a>
<h4><a href="https://rust-lang.zulipchat.com#narrow/stream/131828-t-compiler/topic/planning%20meeting%202019.01.03/near/184740115" class="zl"><img src="https://rust-lang.github.io/zulip_archive/assets/img/zulip.svg" alt="view this post on Zulip" style="width:20px;height:20px;"></a> nikomatsakis <a href="https://rust-lang.github.io/zulip_archive/stream/131828-t-compiler/topic/planning.20meeting.202019.2E01.2E03.html#184740115">(Jan 03 2020 at 15:05)</a>:</h4>
<p>I'm not sure how many proposals we'll have this round anyway... mostly old ones I guess...</p>



<a name="184740128"></a>
<h4><a href="https://rust-lang.zulipchat.com#narrow/stream/131828-t-compiler/topic/planning%20meeting%202019.01.03/near/184740128" class="zl"><img src="https://rust-lang.github.io/zulip_archive/assets/img/zulip.svg" alt="view this post on Zulip" style="width:20px;height:20px;"></a> nikomatsakis <a href="https://rust-lang.github.io/zulip_archive/stream/131828-t-compiler/topic/planning.20meeting.202019.2E01.2E03.html#184740128">(Jan 03 2020 at 15:05)</a>:</h4>
<p>Perhaps first thing to discuss is what days we are scheduling...</p>



<a name="184740141"></a>
<h4><a href="https://rust-lang.zulipchat.com#narrow/stream/131828-t-compiler/topic/planning%20meeting%202019.01.03/near/184740141" class="zl"><img src="https://rust-lang.github.io/zulip_archive/assets/img/zulip.svg" alt="view this post on Zulip" style="width:20px;height:20px;"></a> nikomatsakis <a href="https://rust-lang.github.io/zulip_archive/stream/131828-t-compiler/topic/planning.20meeting.202019.2E01.2E03.html#184740141">(Jan 03 2020 at 15:05)</a>:</h4>
<p>January 10, 17, and 24 according the calendar.</p>



<a name="184740222"></a>
<h4><a href="https://rust-lang.zulipchat.com#narrow/stream/131828-t-compiler/topic/planning%20meeting%202019.01.03/near/184740222" class="zl"><img src="https://rust-lang.github.io/zulip_archive/assets/img/zulip.svg" alt="view this post on Zulip" style="width:20px;height:20px;"></a> nikomatsakis <a href="https://rust-lang.github.io/zulip_archive/stream/131828-t-compiler/topic/planning.20meeting.202019.2E01.2E03.html#184740222">(Jan 03 2020 at 15:06)</a>:</h4>
<p>Er, wait</p>



<a name="184740228"></a>
<h4><a href="https://rust-lang.zulipchat.com#narrow/stream/131828-t-compiler/topic/planning%20meeting%202019.01.03/near/184740228" class="zl"><img src="https://rust-lang.github.io/zulip_archive/assets/img/zulip.svg" alt="view this post on Zulip" style="width:20px;height:20px;"></a> nikomatsakis <a href="https://rust-lang.github.io/zulip_archive/stream/131828-t-compiler/topic/planning.20meeting.202019.2E01.2E03.html#184740228">(Jan 03 2020 at 15:06)</a>:</h4>
<p>Well ok the calendar has the next planning meeting on Jan 17 :)</p>



<a name="184740236"></a>
<h4><a href="https://rust-lang.zulipchat.com#narrow/stream/131828-t-compiler/topic/planning%20meeting%202019.01.03/near/184740236" class="zl"><img src="https://rust-lang.github.io/zulip_archive/assets/img/zulip.svg" alt="view this post on Zulip" style="width:20px;height:20px;"></a> nikomatsakis <a href="https://rust-lang.github.io/zulip_archive/stream/131828-t-compiler/topic/planning.20meeting.202019.2E01.2E03.html#184740236">(Jan 03 2020 at 15:06)</a>:</h4>
<p>It's also worth noting that Jan 31 is the Mozilla All Hands, and <span class="user-mention" data-user-id="116083">@pnkfelix</span>, <span class="user-mention" data-user-id="124287">@mw</span> and I will be in Berlin and probably not able to do a planning or design meeting</p>



<a name="184740237"></a>
<h4><a href="https://rust-lang.zulipchat.com#narrow/stream/131828-t-compiler/topic/planning%20meeting%202019.01.03/near/184740237" class="zl"><img src="https://rust-lang.github.io/zulip_archive/assets/img/zulip.svg" alt="view this post on Zulip" style="width:20px;height:20px;"></a> pnkfelix <a href="https://rust-lang.github.io/zulip_archive/stream/131828-t-compiler/topic/planning.20meeting.202019.2E01.2E03.html#184740237">(Jan 03 2020 at 15:06)</a>:</h4>
<p>yeah I'm trying to understand that too (the planning meeting on the 17th)</p>



<a name="184740248"></a>
<h4><a href="https://rust-lang.zulipchat.com#narrow/stream/131828-t-compiler/topic/planning%20meeting%202019.01.03/near/184740248" class="zl"><img src="https://rust-lang.github.io/zulip_archive/assets/img/zulip.svg" alt="view this post on Zulip" style="width:20px;height:20px;"></a> nikomatsakis <a href="https://rust-lang.github.io/zulip_archive/stream/131828-t-compiler/topic/planning.20meeting.202019.2E01.2E03.html#184740248">(Jan 03 2020 at 15:06)</a>:</h4>
<blockquote>
<p>Well ok the calendar has the next planning meeting on Jan 17 :)</p>
</blockquote>
<p>This is because it was keeping the original "every 4 week" schedule, and I moved one meeting</p>



<a name="184740260"></a>
<h4><a href="https://rust-lang.zulipchat.com#narrow/stream/131828-t-compiler/topic/planning%20meeting%202019.01.03/near/184740260" class="zl"><img src="https://rust-lang.github.io/zulip_archive/assets/img/zulip.svg" alt="view this post on Zulip" style="width:20px;height:20px;"></a> nikomatsakis <a href="https://rust-lang.github.io/zulip_archive/stream/131828-t-compiler/topic/planning.20meeting.202019.2E01.2E03.html#184740260">(Jan 03 2020 at 15:07)</a>:</h4>
<p>but it didn't shift the following meetings I guess</p>



<a name="184740268"></a>
<h4><a href="https://rust-lang.zulipchat.com#narrow/stream/131828-t-compiler/topic/planning%20meeting%202019.01.03/near/184740268" class="zl"><img src="https://rust-lang.github.io/zulip_archive/assets/img/zulip.svg" alt="view this post on Zulip" style="width:20px;height:20px;"></a> nikomatsakis <a href="https://rust-lang.github.io/zulip_archive/stream/131828-t-compiler/topic/planning.20meeting.202019.2E01.2E03.html#184740268">(Jan 03 2020 at 15:07)</a>:</h4>
<p>I could probalby adjust it</p>



<a name="184740293"></a>
<h4><a href="https://rust-lang.zulipchat.com#narrow/stream/131828-t-compiler/topic/planning%20meeting%202019.01.03/near/184740293" class="zl"><img src="https://rust-lang.github.io/zulip_archive/assets/img/zulip.svg" alt="view this post on Zulip" style="width:20px;height:20px;"></a> pnkfelix <a href="https://rust-lang.github.io/zulip_archive/stream/131828-t-compiler/topic/planning.20meeting.202019.2E01.2E03.html#184740293">(Jan 03 2020 at 15:07)</a>:</h4>
<p>well</p>



<a name="184740299"></a>
<h4><a href="https://rust-lang.zulipchat.com#narrow/stream/131828-t-compiler/topic/planning%20meeting%202019.01.03/near/184740299" class="zl"><img src="https://rust-lang.github.io/zulip_archive/assets/img/zulip.svg" alt="view this post on Zulip" style="width:20px;height:20px;"></a> pnkfelix <a href="https://rust-lang.github.io/zulip_archive/stream/131828-t-compiler/topic/planning.20meeting.202019.2E01.2E03.html#184740299">(Jan 03 2020 at 15:07)</a>:</h4>
<p>either we'll fill up the next three meetngs</p>



<a name="184740346"></a>
<h4><a href="https://rust-lang.zulipchat.com#narrow/stream/131828-t-compiler/topic/planning%20meeting%202019.01.03/near/184740346" class="zl"><img src="https://rust-lang.github.io/zulip_archive/assets/img/zulip.svg" alt="view this post on Zulip" style="width:20px;height:20px;"></a> pnkfelix <a href="https://rust-lang.github.io/zulip_archive/stream/131828-t-compiler/topic/planning.20meeting.202019.2E01.2E03.html#184740346">(Jan 03 2020 at 15:08)</a>:</h4>
<p>or we'll have just ... one ...</p>



<a name="184740351"></a>
<h4><a href="https://rust-lang.zulipchat.com#narrow/stream/131828-t-compiler/topic/planning%20meeting%202019.01.03/near/184740351" class="zl"><img src="https://rust-lang.github.io/zulip_archive/assets/img/zulip.svg" alt="view this post on Zulip" style="width:20px;height:20px;"></a> nikomatsakis <a href="https://rust-lang.github.io/zulip_archive/stream/131828-t-compiler/topic/planning.20meeting.202019.2E01.2E03.html#184740351">(Jan 03 2020 at 15:08)</a>:</h4>
<p>but I could also seem some logic in sort of skipping the meeting today/next week and trying again on the 17 :)</p>



<a name="184740360"></a>
<h4><a href="https://rust-lang.zulipchat.com#narrow/stream/131828-t-compiler/topic/planning%20meeting%202019.01.03/near/184740360" class="zl"><img src="https://rust-lang.github.io/zulip_archive/assets/img/zulip.svg" alt="view this post on Zulip" style="width:20px;height:20px;"></a> pnkfelix <a href="https://rust-lang.github.io/zulip_archive/stream/131828-t-compiler/topic/planning.20meeting.202019.2E01.2E03.html#184740360">(Jan 03 2020 at 15:08)</a>:</h4>
<p>maybe lets skim the proposals to inform that decision</p>



<a name="184740373"></a>
<h4><a href="https://rust-lang.zulipchat.com#narrow/stream/131828-t-compiler/topic/planning%20meeting%202019.01.03/near/184740373" class="zl"><img src="https://rust-lang.github.io/zulip_archive/assets/img/zulip.svg" alt="view this post on Zulip" style="width:20px;height:20px;"></a> pnkfelix <a href="https://rust-lang.github.io/zulip_archive/stream/131828-t-compiler/topic/planning.20meeting.202019.2E01.2E03.html#184740373">(Jan 03 2020 at 15:08)</a>:</h4>
<p><a href="https://github.com/rust-lang/compiler-team/issues?q=is%3Aissue+is%3Aopen+label%3Ameeting-proposal" target="_blank" title="https://github.com/rust-lang/compiler-team/issues?q=is%3Aissue+is%3Aopen+label%3Ameeting-proposal">proposals</a></p>



<a name="184740384"></a>
<h4><a href="https://rust-lang.zulipchat.com#narrow/stream/131828-t-compiler/topic/planning%20meeting%202019.01.03/near/184740384" class="zl"><img src="https://rust-lang.github.io/zulip_archive/assets/img/zulip.svg" alt="view this post on Zulip" style="width:20px;height:20px;"></a> nikomatsakis <a href="https://rust-lang.github.io/zulip_archive/stream/131828-t-compiler/topic/planning.20meeting.202019.2E01.2E03.html#184740384">(Jan 03 2020 at 15:08)</a>:</h4>
<p>ps did we never create minutes from the IDE meeting?</p>



<a name="184740388"></a>
<h4><a href="https://rust-lang.zulipchat.com#narrow/stream/131828-t-compiler/topic/planning%20meeting%202019.01.03/near/184740388" class="zl"><img src="https://rust-lang.github.io/zulip_archive/assets/img/zulip.svg" alt="view this post on Zulip" style="width:20px;height:20px;"></a> nikomatsakis <a href="https://rust-lang.github.io/zulip_archive/stream/131828-t-compiler/topic/planning.20meeting.202019.2E01.2E03.html#184740388">(Jan 03 2020 at 15:08)</a>:</h4>
<p>I forget <span class="user-mention" data-user-id="116083">@pnkfelix</span> if you or I was going to do that ...</p>



<a name="184740408"></a>
<h4><a href="https://rust-lang.zulipchat.com#narrow/stream/131828-t-compiler/topic/planning%20meeting%202019.01.03/near/184740408" class="zl"><img src="https://rust-lang.github.io/zulip_archive/assets/img/zulip.svg" alt="view this post on Zulip" style="width:20px;height:20px;"></a> pnkfelix <a href="https://rust-lang.github.io/zulip_archive/stream/131828-t-compiler/topic/planning.20meeting.202019.2E01.2E03.html#184740408">(Jan 03 2020 at 15:09)</a>:</h4>
<p>I think I agreed to do it (I definitely remember <em>starting</em> to do so)</p>



<a name="184740415"></a>
<h4><a href="https://rust-lang.zulipchat.com#narrow/stream/131828-t-compiler/topic/planning%20meeting%202019.01.03/near/184740415" class="zl"><img src="https://rust-lang.github.io/zulip_archive/assets/img/zulip.svg" alt="view this post on Zulip" style="width:20px;height:20px;"></a> nikomatsakis <a href="https://rust-lang.github.io/zulip_archive/stream/131828-t-compiler/topic/planning.20meeting.202019.2E01.2E03.html#184740415">(Jan 03 2020 at 15:09)</a>:</h4>
<p>anyway no big thing</p>



<a name="184740428"></a>
<h4><a href="https://rust-lang.zulipchat.com#narrow/stream/131828-t-compiler/topic/planning%20meeting%202019.01.03/near/184740428" class="zl"><img src="https://rust-lang.github.io/zulip_archive/assets/img/zulip.svg" alt="view this post on Zulip" style="width:20px;height:20px;"></a> nikomatsakis <a href="https://rust-lang.github.io/zulip_archive/stream/131828-t-compiler/topic/planning.20meeting.202019.2E01.2E03.html#184740428">(Jan 03 2020 at 15:09)</a>:</h4>
<ul>
<li>design of the chalk-ty library meeting-proposal <a href="https://github.com/rust-lang/compiler-team/issues/234" target="_blank" title="https://github.com/rust-lang/compiler-team/issues/234">compiler-team#234</a></li>
</ul>



<a name="184740439"></a>
<h4><a href="https://rust-lang.zulipchat.com#narrow/stream/131828-t-compiler/topic/planning%20meeting%202019.01.03/near/184740439" class="zl"><img src="https://rust-lang.github.io/zulip_archive/assets/img/zulip.svg" alt="view this post on Zulip" style="width:20px;height:20px;"></a> nikomatsakis <a href="https://rust-lang.github.io/zulip_archive/stream/131828-t-compiler/topic/planning.20meeting.202019.2E01.2E03.html#184740439">(Jan 03 2020 at 15:09)</a>:</h4>
<ul>
<li><del>rustc licensing guidelines meeting-proposal <a href="https://github.com/rust-lang/compiler-team/issues/220" target="_blank" title="https://github.com/rust-lang/compiler-team/issues/220"><a href="https://github.com/rust-lang/compiler-team/issues/220" target="_blank" title="https://github.com/rust-lang/compiler-team/issues/220">compiler-team#220</a></a></del> (opted to move to a wg-meta issue)</li>
</ul>



<a name="184740452"></a>
<h4><a href="https://rust-lang.zulipchat.com#narrow/stream/131828-t-compiler/topic/planning%20meeting%202019.01.03/near/184740452" class="zl"><img src="https://rust-lang.github.io/zulip_archive/assets/img/zulip.svg" alt="view this post on Zulip" style="width:20px;height:20px;"></a> nikomatsakis <a href="https://rust-lang.github.io/zulip_archive/stream/131828-t-compiler/topic/planning.20meeting.202019.2E01.2E03.html#184740452">(Jan 03 2020 at 15:09)</a>:</h4>
<ul>
<li><del>Constitutional Convention meeting-proposal <a href="https://github.com/rust-lang/compiler-team/issues/184" target="_blank" title="https://github.com/rust-lang/compiler-team/issues/184"><a href="https://github.com/rust-lang/compiler-team/issues/184" target="_blank" title="https://github.com/rust-lang/compiler-team/issues/184">compiler-team#184</a></a></del> (closing)</li>
</ul>



<a name="184740463"></a>
<h4><a href="https://rust-lang.zulipchat.com#narrow/stream/131828-t-compiler/topic/planning%20meeting%202019.01.03/near/184740463" class="zl"><img src="https://rust-lang.github.io/zulip_archive/assets/img/zulip.svg" alt="view this post on Zulip" style="width:20px;height:20px;"></a> nikomatsakis <a href="https://rust-lang.github.io/zulip_archive/stream/131828-t-compiler/topic/planning.20meeting.202019.2E01.2E03.html#184740463">(Jan 03 2020 at 15:09)</a>:</h4>
<ul>
<li><del>merge llvm.sideeffect change meeting-proposal <a href="https://github.com/rust-lang/compiler-team/issues/177" target="_blank" title="https://github.com/rust-lang/compiler-team/issues/177"><a href="https://github.com/rust-lang/compiler-team/issues/177" target="_blank" title="https://github.com/rust-lang/compiler-team/issues/177">compiler-team#177</a></a></del> (requesting data)</li>
</ul>



<a name="184740490"></a>
<h4><a href="https://rust-lang.zulipchat.com#narrow/stream/131828-t-compiler/topic/planning%20meeting%202019.01.03/near/184740490" class="zl"><img src="https://rust-lang.github.io/zulip_archive/assets/img/zulip.svg" alt="view this post on Zulip" style="width:20px;height:20px;"></a> nikomatsakis <a href="https://rust-lang.github.io/zulip_archive/stream/131828-t-compiler/topic/planning.20meeting.202019.2E01.2E03.html#184740490">(Jan 03 2020 at 15:10)</a>:</h4>
<ul>
<li><del>compile time analysis and assistance meeting-proposal <a href="https://github.com/rust-lang/compiler-team/issues/161" target="_blank" title="https://github.com/rust-lang/compiler-team/issues/161"><a href="https://github.com/rust-lang/compiler-team/issues/161" target="_blank" title="https://github.com/rust-lang/compiler-team/issues/161">compiler-team#161</a></a></del> (not ready, maybe should close)</li>
</ul>



<a name="184740519"></a>
<h4><a href="https://rust-lang.zulipchat.com#narrow/stream/131828-t-compiler/topic/planning%20meeting%202019.01.03/near/184740519" class="zl"><img src="https://rust-lang.github.io/zulip_archive/assets/img/zulip.svg" alt="view this post on Zulip" style="width:20px;height:20px;"></a> nikomatsakis <a href="https://rust-lang.github.io/zulip_archive/stream/131828-t-compiler/topic/planning.20meeting.202019.2E01.2E03.html#184740519">(Jan 03 2020 at 15:10)</a>:</h4>
<ul>
<li>Maintenance and triage meeting-proposal <a href="https://github.com/rust-lang/compiler-team/issues/90" target="_blank" title="https://github.com/rust-lang/compiler-team/issues/90">compiler-team#90</a></li>
</ul>



<a name="184740528"></a>
<h4><a href="https://rust-lang.zulipchat.com#narrow/stream/131828-t-compiler/topic/planning%20meeting%202019.01.03/near/184740528" class="zl"><img src="https://rust-lang.github.io/zulip_archive/assets/img/zulip.svg" alt="view this post on Zulip" style="width:20px;height:20px;"></a> nikomatsakis <a href="https://rust-lang.github.io/zulip_archive/stream/131828-t-compiler/topic/planning.20meeting.202019.2E01.2E03.html#184740528">(Jan 03 2020 at 15:10)</a>:</h4>
<blockquote>
<ul>
<li>merge llvm.sideeffect change meeting-proposal <a href="https://github.com/rust-lang/compiler-team/issues/177" target="_blank" title="https://github.com/rust-lang/compiler-team/issues/177">compiler-team#177</a></li>
</ul>
</blockquote>
<p>I thnk here we were waiting for data?</p>



<a name="184740540"></a>
<h4><a href="https://rust-lang.zulipchat.com#narrow/stream/131828-t-compiler/topic/planning%20meeting%202019.01.03/near/184740540" class="zl"><img src="https://rust-lang.github.io/zulip_archive/assets/img/zulip.svg" alt="view this post on Zulip" style="width:20px;height:20px;"></a> nikomatsakis <a href="https://rust-lang.github.io/zulip_archive/stream/131828-t-compiler/topic/planning.20meeting.202019.2E01.2E03.html#184740540">(Jan 03 2020 at 15:10)</a>:</h4>
<p>Maybe <span class="user-mention" data-user-id="124287">@mw</span> was going to gather it from firefox or servo or something?</p>



<a name="184740542"></a>
<h4><a href="https://rust-lang.zulipchat.com#narrow/stream/131828-t-compiler/topic/planning%20meeting%202019.01.03/near/184740542" class="zl"><img src="https://rust-lang.github.io/zulip_archive/assets/img/zulip.svg" alt="view this post on Zulip" style="width:20px;height:20px;"></a> centril <a href="https://rust-lang.github.io/zulip_archive/stream/131828-t-compiler/topic/planning.20meeting.202019.2E01.2E03.html#184740542">(Jan 03 2020 at 15:10)</a>:</h4>
<blockquote>
<p>Rust has had a long-standing problem where LLVM optimizes empty loops into UB. This can very easily create real bugs for folks. We've got a pending PR (<a href="https://github.com/rust-lang/rust/issues/59546" target="_blank" title="https://github.com/rust-lang/rust/issues/59546">#59546</a>) that fixes this by inserting llvm.sideeffect instructions, but until recently it was blocked on getting some lolbench measurements done. These measurements were recently completed (thanks @mati865!). They suggest the impact is "generally" small but non-zero (I put them in a world readable spreadsheet here, feel free to copy and play with it). We need to make a decision whether this is good enough! I'm going to cc the @rust-lang/lang team since I think lang team input would be useful here.</p>
</blockquote>



<a name="184740550"></a>
<h4><a href="https://rust-lang.zulipchat.com#narrow/stream/131828-t-compiler/topic/planning%20meeting%202019.01.03/near/184740550" class="zl"><img src="https://rust-lang.github.io/zulip_archive/assets/img/zulip.svg" alt="view this post on Zulip" style="width:20px;height:20px;"></a> centril <a href="https://rust-lang.github.io/zulip_archive/stream/131828-t-compiler/topic/planning.20meeting.202019.2E01.2E03.html#184740550">(Jan 03 2020 at 15:10)</a>:</h4>
<p>data was gathered?</p>



<a name="184740568"></a>
<h4><a href="https://rust-lang.zulipchat.com#narrow/stream/131828-t-compiler/topic/planning%20meeting%202019.01.03/near/184740568" class="zl"><img src="https://rust-lang.github.io/zulip_archive/assets/img/zulip.svg" alt="view this post on Zulip" style="width:20px;height:20px;"></a> mw <a href="https://rust-lang.github.io/zulip_archive/stream/131828-t-compiler/topic/planning.20meeting.202019.2E01.2E03.html#184740568">(Jan 03 2020 at 15:11)</a>:</h4>
<blockquote>
<p>Maybe <span class="user-mention silent" data-user-id="124287">mw</span> was going to gather it from firefox or servo or something?</p>
</blockquote>
<p>I'll put that on my todo list for monday</p>



<a name="184740569"></a>
<h4><a href="https://rust-lang.zulipchat.com#narrow/stream/131828-t-compiler/topic/planning%20meeting%202019.01.03/near/184740569" class="zl"><img src="https://rust-lang.github.io/zulip_archive/assets/img/zulip.svg" alt="view this post on Zulip" style="width:20px;height:20px;"></a> pnkfelix <a href="https://rust-lang.github.io/zulip_archive/stream/131828-t-compiler/topic/planning.20meeting.202019.2E01.2E03.html#184740569">(Jan 03 2020 at 15:11)</a>:</h4>
<p>since the last time this was discussed?</p>



<a name="184740578"></a>
<h4><a href="https://rust-lang.zulipchat.com#narrow/stream/131828-t-compiler/topic/planning%20meeting%202019.01.03/near/184740578" class="zl"><img src="https://rust-lang.github.io/zulip_archive/assets/img/zulip.svg" alt="view this post on Zulip" style="width:20px;height:20px;"></a> nikomatsakis <a href="https://rust-lang.github.io/zulip_archive/stream/131828-t-compiler/topic/planning.20meeting.202019.2E01.2E03.html#184740578">(Jan 03 2020 at 15:11)</a>:</h4>
<p>I think we said that we would land the PR and gather data from a larger application</p>



<a name="184740593"></a>
<h4><a href="https://rust-lang.zulipchat.com#narrow/stream/131828-t-compiler/topic/planning%20meeting%202019.01.03/near/184740593" class="zl"><img src="https://rust-lang.github.io/zulip_archive/assets/img/zulip.svg" alt="view this post on Zulip" style="width:20px;height:20px;"></a> nikomatsakis <a href="https://rust-lang.github.io/zulip_archive/stream/131828-t-compiler/topic/planning.20meeting.202019.2E01.2E03.html#184740593">(Jan 03 2020 at 15:11)</a>:</h4>
<p><a href="https://github.com/rust-lang/compiler-team/issues/177#issuecomment-535961705" target="_blank" title="https://github.com/rust-lang/compiler-team/issues/177#issuecomment-535961705">see comment here</a></p>



<a name="184740597"></a>
<h4><a href="https://rust-lang.zulipchat.com#narrow/stream/131828-t-compiler/topic/planning%20meeting%202019.01.03/near/184740597" class="zl"><img src="https://rust-lang.github.io/zulip_archive/assets/img/zulip.svg" alt="view this post on Zulip" style="width:20px;height:20px;"></a> pnkfelix <a href="https://rust-lang.github.io/zulip_archive/stream/131828-t-compiler/topic/planning.20meeting.202019.2E01.2E03.html#184740597">(Jan 03 2020 at 15:11)</a>:</h4>
<p>and it is merged, right?</p>



<a name="184740603"></a>
<h4><a href="https://rust-lang.zulipchat.com#narrow/stream/131828-t-compiler/topic/planning%20meeting%202019.01.03/near/184740603" class="zl"><img src="https://rust-lang.github.io/zulip_archive/assets/img/zulip.svg" alt="view this post on Zulip" style="width:20px;height:20px;"></a> mw <a href="https://rust-lang.github.io/zulip_archive/stream/131828-t-compiler/topic/planning.20meeting.202019.2E01.2E03.html#184740603">(Jan 03 2020 at 15:11)</a>:</h4>
<p>(it has gotten slightly more complicated because of changes in FF CI)</p>



<a name="184740607"></a>
<h4><a href="https://rust-lang.zulipchat.com#narrow/stream/131828-t-compiler/topic/planning%20meeting%202019.01.03/near/184740607" class="zl"><img src="https://rust-lang.github.io/zulip_archive/assets/img/zulip.svg" alt="view this post on Zulip" style="width:20px;height:20px;"></a> pnkfelix <a href="https://rust-lang.github.io/zulip_archive/stream/131828-t-compiler/topic/planning.20meeting.202019.2E01.2E03.html#184740607">(Jan 03 2020 at 15:11)</a>:</h4>
<p>(under a Z flag)</p>



<a name="184740612"></a>
<h4><a href="https://rust-lang.zulipchat.com#narrow/stream/131828-t-compiler/topic/planning%20meeting%202019.01.03/near/184740612" class="zl"><img src="https://rust-lang.github.io/zulip_archive/assets/img/zulip.svg" alt="view this post on Zulip" style="width:20px;height:20px;"></a> nikomatsakis <a href="https://rust-lang.github.io/zulip_archive/stream/131828-t-compiler/topic/planning.20meeting.202019.2E01.2E03.html#184740612">(Jan 03 2020 at 15:11)</a>:</h4>
<p>I see I also said something about measuring "some async application" :P</p>



<a name="184740617"></a>
<h4><a href="https://rust-lang.zulipchat.com#narrow/stream/131828-t-compiler/topic/planning%20meeting%202019.01.03/near/184740617" class="zl"><img src="https://rust-lang.github.io/zulip_archive/assets/img/zulip.svg" alt="view this post on Zulip" style="width:20px;height:20px;"></a> mw <a href="https://rust-lang.github.io/zulip_archive/stream/131828-t-compiler/topic/planning.20meeting.202019.2E01.2E03.html#184740617">(Jan 03 2020 at 15:11)</a>:</h4>
<p>Yes, I think so</p>



<a name="184740628"></a>
<h4><a href="https://rust-lang.zulipchat.com#narrow/stream/131828-t-compiler/topic/planning%20meeting%202019.01.03/near/184740628" class="zl"><img src="https://rust-lang.github.io/zulip_archive/assets/img/zulip.svg" alt="view this post on Zulip" style="width:20px;height:20px;"></a> centril <a href="https://rust-lang.github.io/zulip_archive/stream/131828-t-compiler/topic/planning.20meeting.202019.2E01.2E03.html#184740628">(Jan 03 2020 at 15:11)</a>:</h4>
<p>I would like to see a deadline for getting rid of this egregious soundness hole, and some deadline for data-gathering also</p>



<a name="184740677"></a>
<h4><a href="https://rust-lang.zulipchat.com#narrow/stream/131828-t-compiler/topic/planning%20meeting%202019.01.03/near/184740677" class="zl"><img src="https://rust-lang.github.io/zulip_archive/assets/img/zulip.svg" alt="view this post on Zulip" style="width:20px;height:20px;"></a> nikomatsakis <a href="https://rust-lang.github.io/zulip_archive/stream/131828-t-compiler/topic/planning.20meeting.202019.2E01.2E03.html#184740677">(Jan 03 2020 at 15:12)</a>:</h4>
<p>I'm not sure what I meant by that but .. I think there are some pretty standard benchmarks we could run, e.g. hyper serving as a proxy</p>



<a name="184740691"></a>
<h4><a href="https://rust-lang.zulipchat.com#narrow/stream/131828-t-compiler/topic/planning%20meeting%202019.01.03/near/184740691" class="zl"><img src="https://rust-lang.github.io/zulip_archive/assets/img/zulip.svg" alt="view this post on Zulip" style="width:20px;height:20px;"></a> nikomatsakis <a href="https://rust-lang.github.io/zulip_archive/stream/131828-t-compiler/topic/planning.20meeting.202019.2E01.2E03.html#184740691">(Jan 03 2020 at 15:12)</a>:</h4>
<p>I'll ping <span class="user-mention" data-user-id="243965">@Sean McArthur</span> about it :)</p>



<a name="184740708"></a>
<h4><a href="https://rust-lang.zulipchat.com#narrow/stream/131828-t-compiler/topic/planning%20meeting%202019.01.03/near/184740708" class="zl"><img src="https://rust-lang.github.io/zulip_archive/assets/img/zulip.svg" alt="view this post on Zulip" style="width:20px;height:20px;"></a> pnkfelix <a href="https://rust-lang.github.io/zulip_archive/stream/131828-t-compiler/topic/planning.20meeting.202019.2E01.2E03.html#184740708">(Jan 03 2020 at 15:12)</a>:</h4>
<p>you know: We could be a little more aggressive here</p>



<a name="184740714"></a>
<h4><a href="https://rust-lang.zulipchat.com#narrow/stream/131828-t-compiler/topic/planning%20meeting%202019.01.03/near/184740714" class="zl"><img src="https://rust-lang.github.io/zulip_archive/assets/img/zulip.svg" alt="view this post on Zulip" style="width:20px;height:20px;"></a> centril <a href="https://rust-lang.github.io/zulip_archive/stream/131828-t-compiler/topic/planning.20meeting.202019.2E01.2E03.html#184740714">(Jan 03 2020 at 15:12)</a>:</h4>
<p>(I think we need to set expectations that there will be perf regressions, and that we need to live with those...)</p>



<a name="184740717"></a>
<h4><a href="https://rust-lang.zulipchat.com#narrow/stream/131828-t-compiler/topic/planning%20meeting%202019.01.03/near/184740717" class="zl"><img src="https://rust-lang.github.io/zulip_archive/assets/img/zulip.svg" alt="view this post on Zulip" style="width:20px;height:20px;"></a> pnkfelix <a href="https://rust-lang.github.io/zulip_archive/stream/131828-t-compiler/topic/planning.20meeting.202019.2E01.2E03.html#184740717">(Jan 03 2020 at 15:12)</a>:</h4>
<p>by flipping the Z flag meaning</p>



<a name="184740734"></a>
<h4><a href="https://rust-lang.zulipchat.com#narrow/stream/131828-t-compiler/topic/planning%20meeting%202019.01.03/near/184740734" class="zl"><img src="https://rust-lang.github.io/zulip_archive/assets/img/zulip.svg" alt="view this post on Zulip" style="width:20px;height:20px;"></a> pnkfelix <a href="https://rust-lang.github.io/zulip_archive/stream/131828-t-compiler/topic/planning.20meeting.202019.2E01.2E03.html#184740734">(Jan 03 2020 at 15:12)</a>:</h4>
<p>I.e. we turn it on by default, and provide an "easy" way to turn it off</p>



<a name="184740737"></a>
<h4><a href="https://rust-lang.zulipchat.com#narrow/stream/131828-t-compiler/topic/planning%20meeting%202019.01.03/near/184740737" class="zl"><img src="https://rust-lang.github.io/zulip_archive/assets/img/zulip.svg" alt="view this post on Zulip" style="width:20px;height:20px;"></a> pnkfelix <a href="https://rust-lang.github.io/zulip_archive/stream/131828-t-compiler/topic/planning.20meeting.202019.2E01.2E03.html#184740737">(Jan 03 2020 at 15:12)</a>:</h4>
<p>(perhaps even under a <code>-C</code> flag...)</p>



<a name="184740772"></a>
<h4><a href="https://rust-lang.zulipchat.com#narrow/stream/131828-t-compiler/topic/planning%20meeting%202019.01.03/near/184740772" class="zl"><img src="https://rust-lang.github.io/zulip_archive/assets/img/zulip.svg" alt="view this post on Zulip" style="width:20px;height:20px;"></a> centril <a href="https://rust-lang.github.io/zulip_archive/stream/131828-t-compiler/topic/planning.20meeting.202019.2E01.2E03.html#184740772">(Jan 03 2020 at 15:13)</a>:</h4>
<blockquote>
<p>(perhaps even under a -C flag...)</p>
</blockquote>
<p>Soundness should not be subject to <code>-C</code> flags</p>



<a name="184740773"></a>
<h4><a href="https://rust-lang.zulipchat.com#narrow/stream/131828-t-compiler/topic/planning%20meeting%202019.01.03/near/184740773" class="zl"><img src="https://rust-lang.github.io/zulip_archive/assets/img/zulip.svg" alt="view this post on Zulip" style="width:20px;height:20px;"></a> pnkfelix <a href="https://rust-lang.github.io/zulip_archive/stream/131828-t-compiler/topic/planning.20meeting.202019.2E01.2E03.html#184740773">(Jan 03 2020 at 15:13)</a>:</h4>
<p>so that end-users can determine for themselves if it is causing a performance regression for them</p>



<a name="184740780"></a>
<h4><a href="https://rust-lang.zulipchat.com#narrow/stream/131828-t-compiler/topic/planning%20meeting%202019.01.03/near/184740780" class="zl"><img src="https://rust-lang.github.io/zulip_archive/assets/img/zulip.svg" alt="view this post on Zulip" style="width:20px;height:20px;"></a> nikomatsakis <a href="https://rust-lang.github.io/zulip_archive/stream/131828-t-compiler/topic/planning.20meeting.202019.2E01.2E03.html#184740780">(Jan 03 2020 at 15:13)</a>:</h4>
<p>I think we should set a deadline for gathering some more data</p>



<a name="184740810"></a>
<h4><a href="https://rust-lang.zulipchat.com#narrow/stream/131828-t-compiler/topic/planning%20meeting%202019.01.03/near/184740810" class="zl"><img src="https://rust-lang.github.io/zulip_archive/assets/img/zulip.svg" alt="view this post on Zulip" style="width:20px;height:20px;"></a> centril <a href="https://rust-lang.github.io/zulip_archive/stream/131828-t-compiler/topic/planning.20meeting.202019.2E01.2E03.html#184740810">(Jan 03 2020 at 15:13)</a>:</h4>
<p>(e.g. <code>-C no-alias</code> is also something that I think we should never have)</p>



<a name="184740890"></a>
<h4><a href="https://rust-lang.zulipchat.com#narrow/stream/131828-t-compiler/topic/planning%20meeting%202019.01.03/near/184740890" class="zl"><img src="https://rust-lang.github.io/zulip_archive/assets/img/zulip.svg" alt="view this post on Zulip" style="width:20px;height:20px;"></a> nikomatsakis <a href="https://rust-lang.github.io/zulip_archive/stream/131828-t-compiler/topic/planning.20meeting.202019.2E01.2E03.html#184740890">(Jan 03 2020 at 15:14)</a>:</h4>
<p>I wouldn't be in favor of a permanent <code>-C</code> flag around this</p>



<a name="184740903"></a>
<h4><a href="https://rust-lang.zulipchat.com#narrow/stream/131828-t-compiler/topic/planning%20meeting%202019.01.03/near/184740903" class="zl"><img src="https://rust-lang.github.io/zulip_archive/assets/img/zulip.svg" alt="view this post on Zulip" style="width:20px;height:20px;"></a> pnkfelix <a href="https://rust-lang.github.io/zulip_archive/stream/131828-t-compiler/topic/planning.20meeting.202019.2E01.2E03.html#184740903">(Jan 03 2020 at 15:14)</a>:</h4>
<p>I'm happy to retract my suggestion (of making it a <code>-C</code> flag)</p>



<a name="184740915"></a>
<h4><a href="https://rust-lang.zulipchat.com#narrow/stream/131828-t-compiler/topic/planning%20meeting%202019.01.03/near/184740915" class="zl"><img src="https://rust-lang.github.io/zulip_archive/assets/img/zulip.svg" alt="view this post on Zulip" style="width:20px;height:20px;"></a> pnkfelix <a href="https://rust-lang.github.io/zulip_archive/stream/131828-t-compiler/topic/planning.20meeting.202019.2E01.2E03.html#184740915">(Jan 03 2020 at 15:14)</a>:</h4>
<p>just trying to make it easy for people off of nightly to do the aforementioned experiment</p>



<a name="184740927"></a>
<h4><a href="https://rust-lang.zulipchat.com#narrow/stream/131828-t-compiler/topic/planning%20meeting%202019.01.03/near/184740927" class="zl"><img src="https://rust-lang.github.io/zulip_archive/assets/img/zulip.svg" alt="view this post on Zulip" style="width:20px;height:20px;"></a> centril <a href="https://rust-lang.github.io/zulip_archive/stream/131828-t-compiler/topic/planning.20meeting.202019.2E01.2E03.html#184740927">(Jan 03 2020 at 15:14)</a>:</h4>
<p>What would a suitable deadline be? 1 month?</p>



<a name="184740936"></a>
<h4><a href="https://rust-lang.zulipchat.com#narrow/stream/131828-t-compiler/topic/planning%20meeting%202019.01.03/near/184740936" class="zl"><img src="https://rust-lang.github.io/zulip_archive/assets/img/zulip.svg" alt="view this post on Zulip" style="width:20px;height:20px;"></a> nikomatsakis <a href="https://rust-lang.github.io/zulip_archive/stream/131828-t-compiler/topic/planning.20meeting.202019.2E01.2E03.html#184740936">(Jan 03 2020 at 15:14)</a>:</h4>
<p>(But I think flipping the default and keeping the flag for a bit, so people can measure the impact, isn't a bad idea)</p>



<a name="184740972"></a>
<h4><a href="https://rust-lang.zulipchat.com#narrow/stream/131828-t-compiler/topic/planning%20meeting%202019.01.03/near/184740972" class="zl"><img src="https://rust-lang.github.io/zulip_archive/assets/img/zulip.svg" alt="view this post on Zulip" style="width:20px;height:20px;"></a> nikomatsakis <a href="https://rust-lang.github.io/zulip_archive/stream/131828-t-compiler/topic/planning.20meeting.202019.2E01.2E03.html#184740972">(Jan 03 2020 at 15:15)</a>:</h4>
<blockquote>
<p>What would a suitable deadline be? 1 month?</p>
</blockquote>
<p>I was going to say something like that, yeah, sort of "by next planning meeting", except we don't know when that'll be :P</p>



<a name="184740975"></a>
<h4><a href="https://rust-lang.zulipchat.com#narrow/stream/131828-t-compiler/topic/planning%20meeting%202019.01.03/near/184740975" class="zl"><img src="https://rust-lang.github.io/zulip_archive/assets/img/zulip.svg" alt="view this post on Zulip" style="width:20px;height:20px;"></a> mw <a href="https://rust-lang.github.io/zulip_archive/stream/131828-t-compiler/topic/planning.20meeting.202019.2E01.2E03.html#184740975">(Jan 03 2020 at 15:15)</a>:</h4>
<p>as long as we revert that change before it hits beta</p>



<a name="184740977"></a>
<h4><a href="https://rust-lang.zulipchat.com#narrow/stream/131828-t-compiler/topic/planning%20meeting%202019.01.03/near/184740977" class="zl"><img src="https://rust-lang.github.io/zulip_archive/assets/img/zulip.svg" alt="view this post on Zulip" style="width:20px;height:20px;"></a> pnkfelix <a href="https://rust-lang.github.io/zulip_archive/stream/131828-t-compiler/topic/planning.20meeting.202019.2E01.2E03.html#184740977">(Jan 03 2020 at 15:15)</a>:</h4>
<blockquote>
<p>What would a suitable deadline be? 1 month?</p>
</blockquote>
<p>somewhere between 1 month and a release cycle sounds plausible to me.</p>



<a name="184740983"></a>
<h4><a href="https://rust-lang.zulipchat.com#narrow/stream/131828-t-compiler/topic/planning%20meeting%202019.01.03/near/184740983" class="zl"><img src="https://rust-lang.github.io/zulip_archive/assets/img/zulip.svg" alt="view this post on Zulip" style="width:20px;height:20px;"></a> nikomatsakis <a href="https://rust-lang.github.io/zulip_archive/stream/131828-t-compiler/topic/planning.20meeting.202019.2E01.2E03.html#184740983">(Jan 03 2020 at 15:15)</a>:</h4>
<p>I think it should be something like this</p>



<a name="184740985"></a>
<h4><a href="https://rust-lang.zulipchat.com#narrow/stream/131828-t-compiler/topic/planning%20meeting%202019.01.03/near/184740985" class="zl"><img src="https://rust-lang.github.io/zulip_archive/assets/img/zulip.svg" alt="view this post on Zulip" style="width:20px;height:20px;"></a> centril <a href="https://rust-lang.github.io/zulip_archive/stream/131828-t-compiler/topic/planning.20meeting.202019.2E01.2E03.html#184740985">(Jan 03 2020 at 15:15)</a>:</h4>
<p>At least on nightly I think we should feel comfortable trying out sound-by-default and flag to opt out</p>



<a name="184740986"></a>
<h4><a href="https://rust-lang.zulipchat.com#narrow/stream/131828-t-compiler/topic/planning%20meeting%202019.01.03/near/184740986" class="zl"><img src="https://rust-lang.github.io/zulip_archive/assets/img/zulip.svg" alt="view this post on Zulip" style="width:20px;height:20px;"></a> nikomatsakis <a href="https://rust-lang.github.io/zulip_archive/stream/131828-t-compiler/topic/planning.20meeting.202019.2E01.2E03.html#184740986">(Jan 03 2020 at 15:15)</a>:</h4>
<p>We intend to <del>land the change</del> (flip the default)</p>



<a name="184741038"></a>
<h4><a href="https://rust-lang.zulipchat.com#narrow/stream/131828-t-compiler/topic/planning%20meeting%202019.01.03/near/184741038" class="zl"><img src="https://rust-lang.github.io/zulip_archive/assets/img/zulip.svg" alt="view this post on Zulip" style="width:20px;height:20px;"></a> nikomatsakis <a href="https://rust-lang.github.io/zulip_archive/stream/131828-t-compiler/topic/planning.20meeting.202019.2E01.2E03.html#184741038">(Jan 03 2020 at 15:16)</a>:</h4>
<p>But we have some time for people to convince us it's going to have a very high impact :)</p>



<a name="184741128"></a>
<h4><a href="https://rust-lang.zulipchat.com#narrow/stream/131828-t-compiler/topic/planning%20meeting%202019.01.03/near/184741128" class="zl"><img src="https://rust-lang.github.io/zulip_archive/assets/img/zulip.svg" alt="view this post on Zulip" style="width:20px;height:20px;"></a> nikomatsakis <a href="https://rust-lang.github.io/zulip_archive/stream/131828-t-compiler/topic/planning.20meeting.202019.2E01.2E03.html#184741128">(Jan 03 2020 at 15:17)</a>:</h4>
<p>ok, moving on..?</p>



<a name="184741177"></a>
<h4><a href="https://rust-lang.zulipchat.com#narrow/stream/131828-t-compiler/topic/planning%20meeting%202019.01.03/near/184741177" class="zl"><img src="https://rust-lang.github.io/zulip_archive/assets/img/zulip.svg" alt="view this post on Zulip" style="width:20px;height:20px;"></a> nikomatsakis <a href="https://rust-lang.github.io/zulip_archive/stream/131828-t-compiler/topic/planning.20meeting.202019.2E01.2E03.html#184741177">(Jan 03 2020 at 15:18)</a>:</h4>
<p>let me leave a comment</p>



<a name="184741276"></a>
<h4><a href="https://rust-lang.zulipchat.com#narrow/stream/131828-t-compiler/topic/planning%20meeting%202019.01.03/near/184741276" class="zl"><img src="https://rust-lang.github.io/zulip_archive/assets/img/zulip.svg" alt="view this post on Zulip" style="width:20px;height:20px;"></a> nikomatsakis <a href="https://rust-lang.github.io/zulip_archive/stream/131828-t-compiler/topic/planning.20meeting.202019.2E01.2E03.html#184741276">(Jan 03 2020 at 15:19)</a>:</h4>
<blockquote>
<ul>
<li>Constitutional Convention meeting-proposal <a href="https://github.com/rust-lang/compiler-team/issues/184" target="_blank" title="https://github.com/rust-lang/compiler-team/issues/184">compiler-team#184</a></li>
</ul>
</blockquote>
<p>I think <span class="user-mention" data-user-id="116083">@pnkfelix</span> this is perhaps a bit "vague", I feel like I'm not quite sure what scope we had in mind anymore</p>



<a name="184741282"></a>
<h4><a href="https://rust-lang.zulipchat.com#narrow/stream/131828-t-compiler/topic/planning%20meeting%202019.01.03/near/184741282" class="zl"><img src="https://rust-lang.github.io/zulip_archive/assets/img/zulip.svg" alt="view this post on Zulip" style="width:20px;height:20px;"></a> pnkfelix <a href="https://rust-lang.github.io/zulip_archive/stream/131828-t-compiler/topic/planning.20meeting.202019.2E01.2E03.html#184741282">(Jan 03 2020 at 15:20)</a>:</h4>
<p>i know</p>



<a name="184741323"></a>
<h4><a href="https://rust-lang.zulipchat.com#narrow/stream/131828-t-compiler/topic/planning%20meeting%202019.01.03/near/184741323" class="zl"><img src="https://rust-lang.github.io/zulip_archive/assets/img/zulip.svg" alt="view this post on Zulip" style="width:20px;height:20px;"></a> pnkfelix <a href="https://rust-lang.github.io/zulip_archive/stream/131828-t-compiler/topic/planning.20meeting.202019.2E01.2E03.html#184741323">(Jan 03 2020 at 15:20)</a>:</h4>
<p>when it came up earlier</p>



<a name="184741325"></a>
<h4><a href="https://rust-lang.zulipchat.com#narrow/stream/131828-t-compiler/topic/planning%20meeting%202019.01.03/near/184741325" class="zl"><img src="https://rust-lang.github.io/zulip_archive/assets/img/zulip.svg" alt="view this post on Zulip" style="width:20px;height:20px;"></a> centril <a href="https://rust-lang.github.io/zulip_archive/stream/131828-t-compiler/topic/planning.20meeting.202019.2E01.2E03.html#184741325">(Jan 03 2020 at 15:20)</a>:</h4>
<blockquote>
<p>We intend to <del>land the change</del> (flip the default)</p>
</blockquote>
<p>(Ultimately, at the end of the day, I think we'll need to come to terms with that this might have even 10% runtime perf effects and that due to our global commitment to soundness, we have no choice but to accept that)</p>



<a name="184741330"></a>
<h4><a href="https://rust-lang.zulipchat.com#narrow/stream/131828-t-compiler/topic/planning%20meeting%202019.01.03/near/184741330" class="zl"><img src="https://rust-lang.github.io/zulip_archive/assets/img/zulip.svg" alt="view this post on Zulip" style="width:20px;height:20px;"></a> pnkfelix <a href="https://rust-lang.github.io/zulip_archive/stream/131828-t-compiler/topic/planning.20meeting.202019.2E01.2E03.html#184741330">(Jan 03 2020 at 15:20)</a>:</h4>
<p>I was wondering if such formalism makes sense (the "Constitutional Convention")</p>



<a name="184741357"></a>
<h4><a href="https://rust-lang.zulipchat.com#narrow/stream/131828-t-compiler/topic/planning%20meeting%202019.01.03/near/184741357" class="zl"><img src="https://rust-lang.github.io/zulip_archive/assets/img/zulip.svg" alt="view this post on Zulip" style="width:20px;height:20px;"></a> pnkfelix <a href="https://rust-lang.github.io/zulip_archive/stream/131828-t-compiler/topic/planning.20meeting.202019.2E01.2E03.html#184741357">(Jan 03 2020 at 15:20)</a>:</h4>
<p>versus continuing to just go "organically"</p>



<a name="184741387"></a>
<h4><a href="https://rust-lang.zulipchat.com#narrow/stream/131828-t-compiler/topic/planning%20meeting%202019.01.03/near/184741387" class="zl"><img src="https://rust-lang.github.io/zulip_archive/assets/img/zulip.svg" alt="view this post on Zulip" style="width:20px;height:20px;"></a> nikomatsakis <a href="https://rust-lang.github.io/zulip_archive/stream/131828-t-compiler/topic/planning.20meeting.202019.2E01.2E03.html#184741387">(Jan 03 2020 at 15:21)</a>:</h4>
<p>I'm inclined to lean towards organic at this time</p>



<a name="184741419"></a>
<h4><a href="https://rust-lang.zulipchat.com#narrow/stream/131828-t-compiler/topic/planning%20meeting%202019.01.03/near/184741419" class="zl"><img src="https://rust-lang.github.io/zulip_archive/assets/img/zulip.svg" alt="view this post on Zulip" style="width:20px;height:20px;"></a> pnkfelix <a href="https://rust-lang.github.io/zulip_archive/stream/131828-t-compiler/topic/planning.20meeting.202019.2E01.2E03.html#184741419">(Jan 03 2020 at 15:21)</a>:</h4>
<p>okay lets just close that meeting proposal themn</p>



<a name="184741425"></a>
<h4><a href="https://rust-lang.zulipchat.com#narrow/stream/131828-t-compiler/topic/planning%20meeting%202019.01.03/near/184741425" class="zl"><img src="https://rust-lang.github.io/zulip_archive/assets/img/zulip.svg" alt="view this post on Zulip" style="width:20px;height:20px;"></a> nikomatsakis <a href="https://rust-lang.github.io/zulip_archive/stream/131828-t-compiler/topic/planning.20meeting.202019.2E01.2E03.html#184741425">(Jan 03 2020 at 15:21)</a>:</h4>
<p>I think we have some ideas (e.g., following up with working group leads, etc) that we haven't done</p>



<a name="184741430"></a>
<h4><a href="https://rust-lang.zulipchat.com#narrow/stream/131828-t-compiler/topic/planning%20meeting%202019.01.03/near/184741430" class="zl"><img src="https://rust-lang.github.io/zulip_archive/assets/img/zulip.svg" alt="view this post on Zulip" style="width:20px;height:20px;"></a> centril <a href="https://rust-lang.github.io/zulip_archive/stream/131828-t-compiler/topic/planning.20meeting.202019.2E01.2E03.html#184741430">(Jan 03 2020 at 15:21)</a>:</h4>
<p>Agree with <span class="user-mention" data-user-id="116009">@nikomatsakis</span> -- overall it seems to work well</p>



<a name="184741433"></a>
<h4><a href="https://rust-lang.zulipchat.com#narrow/stream/131828-t-compiler/topic/planning%20meeting%202019.01.03/near/184741433" class="zl"><img src="https://rust-lang.github.io/zulip_archive/assets/img/zulip.svg" alt="view this post on Zulip" style="width:20px;height:20px;"></a> nikomatsakis <a href="https://rust-lang.github.io/zulip_archive/stream/131828-t-compiler/topic/planning.20meeting.202019.2E01.2E03.html#184741433">(Jan 03 2020 at 15:21)</a>:</h4>
<p>and I'd rather try to organize around those</p>



<a name="184741485"></a>
<h4><a href="https://rust-lang.zulipchat.com#narrow/stream/131828-t-compiler/topic/planning%20meeting%202019.01.03/near/184741485" class="zl"><img src="https://rust-lang.github.io/zulip_archive/assets/img/zulip.svg" alt="view this post on Zulip" style="width:20px;height:20px;"></a> centril <a href="https://rust-lang.github.io/zulip_archive/stream/131828-t-compiler/topic/planning.20meeting.202019.2E01.2E03.html#184741485">(Jan 03 2020 at 15:22)</a>:</h4>
<p>or rather semi-organic with some light steering</p>



<a name="184741486"></a>
<h4><a href="https://rust-lang.zulipchat.com#narrow/stream/131828-t-compiler/topic/planning%20meeting%202019.01.03/near/184741486" class="zl"><img src="https://rust-lang.github.io/zulip_archive/assets/img/zulip.svg" alt="view this post on Zulip" style="width:20px;height:20px;"></a> pnkfelix <a href="https://rust-lang.github.io/zulip_archive/stream/131828-t-compiler/topic/planning.20meeting.202019.2E01.2E03.html#184741486">(Jan 03 2020 at 15:22)</a>:</h4>
<p>I'll leave a comment and close the issue</p>



<a name="184741508"></a>
<h4><a href="https://rust-lang.zulipchat.com#narrow/stream/131828-t-compiler/topic/planning%20meeting%202019.01.03/near/184741508" class="zl"><img src="https://rust-lang.github.io/zulip_archive/assets/img/zulip.svg" alt="view this post on Zulip" style="width:20px;height:20px;"></a> nikomatsakis <a href="https://rust-lang.github.io/zulip_archive/stream/131828-t-compiler/topic/planning.20meeting.202019.2E01.2E03.html#184741508">(Jan 03 2020 at 15:22)</a>:</h4>
<blockquote>
<ul>
<li>Maintenance and triage meeting-proposal <a href="https://github.com/rust-lang/compiler-team/issues/90" target="_blank" title="https://github.com/rust-lang/compiler-team/issues/90">compiler-team#90</a></li>
</ul>
</blockquote>
<p>I <em>do</em> still think there's a discussion to be had here, but I'm not sure if we're at a good point for compiler-team meeting yet.</p>



<a name="184741738"></a>
<h4><a href="https://rust-lang.zulipchat.com#narrow/stream/131828-t-compiler/topic/planning%20meeting%202019.01.03/near/184741738" class="zl"><img src="https://rust-lang.github.io/zulip_archive/assets/img/zulip.svg" alt="view this post on Zulip" style="width:20px;height:20px;"></a> nikomatsakis <a href="https://rust-lang.github.io/zulip_archive/stream/131828-t-compiler/topic/planning.20meeting.202019.2E01.2E03.html#184741738">(Jan 03 2020 at 15:25)</a>:</h4>
<blockquote>
<ul>
<li>compile time analysis and assistance meeting-proposal <a href="https://github.com/rust-lang/compiler-team/issues/161" target="_blank" title="https://github.com/rust-lang/compiler-team/issues/161">compiler-team#161</a></li>
</ul>
</blockquote>
<p>on this topic, I'm curious <span class="user-mention" data-user-id="124287">@mw</span> what you think. I was thinking it'd be good to maybe try to have some setup where people can bring their compile time problems and we might try to help them diagnose. It seems like a win-win, in that we help people but also get a better idea what is causing people's compilation problems. With <code>-Zself-profile</code>, it may also be fairly light-weight to get started... but still, where do the "people" come from?</p>
<p>So I started to think it'd be better for companies like Ferrous / Lyken to provide these services. I still sort of think that. So i'm kind of inclined to close this as I don't quite know what we would talk about yet.</p>



<a name="184741847"></a>
<h4><a href="https://rust-lang.zulipchat.com#narrow/stream/131828-t-compiler/topic/planning%20meeting%202019.01.03/near/184741847" class="zl"><img src="https://rust-lang.github.io/zulip_archive/assets/img/zulip.svg" alt="view this post on Zulip" style="width:20px;height:20px;"></a> mw <a href="https://rust-lang.github.io/zulip_archive/stream/131828-t-compiler/topic/planning.20meeting.202019.2E01.2E03.html#184741847">(Jan 03 2020 at 15:26)</a>:</h4>
<p>I think that's a good idea generally</p>



<a name="184741856"></a>
<h4><a href="https://rust-lang.zulipchat.com#narrow/stream/131828-t-compiler/topic/planning%20meeting%202019.01.03/near/184741856" class="zl"><img src="https://rust-lang.github.io/zulip_archive/assets/img/zulip.svg" alt="view this post on Zulip" style="width:20px;height:20px;"></a> mw <a href="https://rust-lang.github.io/zulip_archive/stream/131828-t-compiler/topic/planning.20meeting.202019.2E01.2E03.html#184741856">(Jan 03 2020 at 15:26)</a>:</h4>
<p>but I personally probably won't have much time</p>



<a name="184741884"></a>
<h4><a href="https://rust-lang.zulipchat.com#narrow/stream/131828-t-compiler/topic/planning%20meeting%202019.01.03/near/184741884" class="zl"><img src="https://rust-lang.github.io/zulip_archive/assets/img/zulip.svg" alt="view this post on Zulip" style="width:20px;height:20px;"></a> mw <a href="https://rust-lang.github.io/zulip_archive/stream/131828-t-compiler/topic/planning.20meeting.202019.2E01.2E03.html#184741884">(Jan 03 2020 at 15:27)</a>:</h4>
<p>i.e. I won't be able to allocate a lot of time towards that</p>



<a name="184741900"></a>
<h4><a href="https://rust-lang.zulipchat.com#narrow/stream/131828-t-compiler/topic/planning%20meeting%202019.01.03/near/184741900" class="zl"><img src="https://rust-lang.github.io/zulip_archive/assets/img/zulip.svg" alt="view this post on Zulip" style="width:20px;height:20px;"></a> nikomatsakis <a href="https://rust-lang.github.io/zulip_archive/stream/131828-t-compiler/topic/planning.20meeting.202019.2E01.2E03.html#184741900">(Jan 03 2020 at 15:27)</a>:</h4>
<p>yeah</p>



<a name="184741915"></a>
<h4><a href="https://rust-lang.zulipchat.com#narrow/stream/131828-t-compiler/topic/planning%20meeting%202019.01.03/near/184741915" class="zl"><img src="https://rust-lang.github.io/zulip_archive/assets/img/zulip.svg" alt="view this post on Zulip" style="width:20px;height:20px;"></a> mw <a href="https://rust-lang.github.io/zulip_archive/stream/131828-t-compiler/topic/planning.20meeting.202019.2E01.2E03.html#184741915">(Jan 03 2020 at 15:27)</a>:</h4>
<p>unless you all convince the FF org that it is good for Firefox</p>



<a name="184741918"></a>
<h4><a href="https://rust-lang.zulipchat.com#narrow/stream/131828-t-compiler/topic/planning%20meeting%202019.01.03/near/184741918" class="zl"><img src="https://rust-lang.github.io/zulip_archive/assets/img/zulip.svg" alt="view this post on Zulip" style="width:20px;height:20px;"></a> pnkfelix <a href="https://rust-lang.github.io/zulip_archive/stream/131828-t-compiler/topic/planning.20meeting.202019.2E01.2E03.html#184741918">(Jan 03 2020 at 15:27)</a>:</h4>
<p>what's the main drawback with the Ferrous/Lyken approach?</p>



<a name="184741921"></a>
<h4><a href="https://rust-lang.zulipchat.com#narrow/stream/131828-t-compiler/topic/planning%20meeting%202019.01.03/near/184741921" class="zl"><img src="https://rust-lang.github.io/zulip_archive/assets/img/zulip.svg" alt="view this post on Zulip" style="width:20px;height:20px;"></a> mw <a href="https://rust-lang.github.io/zulip_archive/stream/131828-t-compiler/topic/planning.20meeting.202019.2E01.2E03.html#184741921">(Jan 03 2020 at 15:27)</a>:</h4>
<p>:)</p>



<a name="184741928"></a>
<h4><a href="https://rust-lang.zulipchat.com#narrow/stream/131828-t-compiler/topic/planning%20meeting%202019.01.03/near/184741928" class="zl"><img src="https://rust-lang.github.io/zulip_archive/assets/img/zulip.svg" alt="view this post on Zulip" style="width:20px;height:20px;"></a> nikomatsakis <a href="https://rust-lang.github.io/zulip_archive/stream/131828-t-compiler/topic/planning.20meeting.202019.2E01.2E03.html#184741928">(Jan 03 2020 at 15:27)</a>:</h4>
<p>I mean the "minimal version" might be to have e.g. a Zulip stream</p>



<a name="184741939"></a>
<h4><a href="https://rust-lang.zulipchat.com#narrow/stream/131828-t-compiler/topic/planning%20meeting%202019.01.03/near/184741939" class="zl"><img src="https://rust-lang.github.io/zulip_archive/assets/img/zulip.svg" alt="view this post on Zulip" style="width:20px;height:20px;"></a> nikomatsakis <a href="https://rust-lang.github.io/zulip_archive/stream/131828-t-compiler/topic/planning.20meeting.202019.2E01.2E03.html#184741939">(Jan 03 2020 at 15:27)</a>:</h4>
<p>where people can pop in and request</p>



<a name="184742000"></a>
<h4><a href="https://rust-lang.zulipchat.com#narrow/stream/131828-t-compiler/topic/planning%20meeting%202019.01.03/near/184742000" class="zl"><img src="https://rust-lang.github.io/zulip_archive/assets/img/zulip.svg" alt="view this post on Zulip" style="width:20px;height:20px;"></a> nikomatsakis <a href="https://rust-lang.github.io/zulip_archive/stream/131828-t-compiler/topic/planning.20meeting.202019.2E01.2E03.html#184742000">(Jan 03 2020 at 15:28)</a>:</h4>
<p>anyway, I... think I might just close it for now</p>



<a name="184742008"></a>
<h4><a href="https://rust-lang.zulipchat.com#narrow/stream/131828-t-compiler/topic/planning%20meeting%202019.01.03/near/184742008" class="zl"><img src="https://rust-lang.github.io/zulip_archive/assets/img/zulip.svg" alt="view this post on Zulip" style="width:20px;height:20px;"></a> pnkfelix <a href="https://rust-lang.github.io/zulip_archive/stream/131828-t-compiler/topic/planning.20meeting.202019.2E01.2E03.html#184742008">(Jan 03 2020 at 15:28)</a>:</h4>
<p>the only drawback I can imagine is that a customer might not think they have enough "pull" compared to engaging with ... Mozilla directly? But I don't think that logic really holds up.</p>



<a name="184742020"></a>
<h4><a href="https://rust-lang.zulipchat.com#narrow/stream/131828-t-compiler/topic/planning%20meeting%202019.01.03/near/184742020" class="zl"><img src="https://rust-lang.github.io/zulip_archive/assets/img/zulip.svg" alt="view this post on Zulip" style="width:20px;height:20px;"></a> nikomatsakis <a href="https://rust-lang.github.io/zulip_archive/stream/131828-t-compiler/topic/planning.20meeting.202019.2E01.2E03.html#184742020">(Jan 03 2020 at 15:28)</a>:</h4>
<p>I don't see mozilla doing this or this being good for FF org in particular</p>



<a name="184742021"></a>
<h4><a href="https://rust-lang.zulipchat.com#narrow/stream/131828-t-compiler/topic/planning%20meeting%202019.01.03/near/184742021" class="zl"><img src="https://rust-lang.github.io/zulip_archive/assets/img/zulip.svg" alt="view this post on Zulip" style="width:20px;height:20px;"></a> centril <a href="https://rust-lang.github.io/zulip_archive/stream/131828-t-compiler/topic/planning.20meeting.202019.2E01.2E03.html#184742021">(Jan 03 2020 at 15:28)</a>:</h4>
<p>fwiw, I think we should be interested in diagnosing the problems not least because it makes <code>./x.py</code> go faster, which <span aria-label="heart" class="emoji emoji-2764" role="img" title="heart">:heart:</span></p>



<a name="184742052"></a>
<h4><a href="https://rust-lang.zulipchat.com#narrow/stream/131828-t-compiler/topic/planning%20meeting%202019.01.03/near/184742052" class="zl"><img src="https://rust-lang.github.io/zulip_archive/assets/img/zulip.svg" alt="view this post on Zulip" style="width:20px;height:20px;"></a> mw <a href="https://rust-lang.github.io/zulip_archive/stream/131828-t-compiler/topic/planning.20meeting.202019.2E01.2E03.html#184742052">(Jan 03 2020 at 15:29)</a>:</h4>
<p>I think there's generally lots of potential in the tooling around this</p>



<a name="184742057"></a>
<h4><a href="https://rust-lang.zulipchat.com#narrow/stream/131828-t-compiler/topic/planning%20meeting%202019.01.03/near/184742057" class="zl"><img src="https://rust-lang.github.io/zulip_archive/assets/img/zulip.svg" alt="view this post on Zulip" style="width:20px;height:20px;"></a> nikomatsakis <a href="https://rust-lang.github.io/zulip_archive/stream/131828-t-compiler/topic/planning.20meeting.202019.2E01.2E03.html#184742057">(Jan 03 2020 at 15:29)</a>:</h4>
<p>well, I guess we could have a meeting about it, to talk about what we can do to help folks. if nothing else, advertisting or talking about the companies that might do it would be interesting</p>



<a name="184742071"></a>
<h4><a href="https://rust-lang.zulipchat.com#narrow/stream/131828-t-compiler/topic/planning%20meeting%202019.01.03/near/184742071" class="zl"><img src="https://rust-lang.github.io/zulip_archive/assets/img/zulip.svg" alt="view this post on Zulip" style="width:20px;height:20px;"></a> nikomatsakis <a href="https://rust-lang.github.io/zulip_archive/stream/131828-t-compiler/topic/planning.20meeting.202019.2E01.2E03.html#184742071">(Jan 03 2020 at 15:29)</a>:</h4>
<p>and/or maybe something like creating a zulip stream</p>



<a name="184742073"></a>
<h4><a href="https://rust-lang.zulipchat.com#narrow/stream/131828-t-compiler/topic/planning%20meeting%202019.01.03/near/184742073" class="zl"><img src="https://rust-lang.github.io/zulip_archive/assets/img/zulip.svg" alt="view this post on Zulip" style="width:20px;height:20px;"></a> nikomatsakis <a href="https://rust-lang.github.io/zulip_archive/stream/131828-t-compiler/topic/planning.20meeting.202019.2E01.2E03.html#184742073">(Jan 03 2020 at 15:29)</a>:</h4>
<p>I've not really talked much to Ferrous about this <em>specifically</em></p>



<a name="184742091"></a>
<h4><a href="https://rust-lang.zulipchat.com#narrow/stream/131828-t-compiler/topic/planning%20meeting%202019.01.03/near/184742091" class="zl"><img src="https://rust-lang.github.io/zulip_archive/assets/img/zulip.svg" alt="view this post on Zulip" style="width:20px;height:20px;"></a> nikomatsakis <a href="https://rust-lang.github.io/zulip_archive/stream/131828-t-compiler/topic/planning.20meeting.202019.2E01.2E03.html#184742091">(Jan 03 2020 at 15:29)</a>:</h4>
<p>but I'm not sure a meeting is what's really needed as next steps I guess</p>



<a name="184742140"></a>
<h4><a href="https://rust-lang.zulipchat.com#narrow/stream/131828-t-compiler/topic/planning%20meeting%202019.01.03/near/184742140" class="zl"><img src="https://rust-lang.github.io/zulip_archive/assets/img/zulip.svg" alt="view this post on Zulip" style="width:20px;height:20px;"></a> mw <a href="https://rust-lang.github.io/zulip_archive/stream/131828-t-compiler/topic/planning.20meeting.202019.2E01.2E03.html#184742140">(Jan 03 2020 at 15:30)</a>:</h4>
<p>agreed</p>



<a name="184742168"></a>
<h4><a href="https://rust-lang.zulipchat.com#narrow/stream/131828-t-compiler/topic/planning%20meeting%202019.01.03/near/184742168" class="zl"><img src="https://rust-lang.github.io/zulip_archive/assets/img/zulip.svg" alt="view this post on Zulip" style="width:20px;height:20px;"></a> nikomatsakis <a href="https://rust-lang.github.io/zulip_archive/stream/131828-t-compiler/topic/planning.20meeting.202019.2E01.2E03.html#184742168">(Jan 03 2020 at 15:30)</a>:</h4>
<blockquote>
<ul>
<li>rustc licensing guidelines meeting-proposal <a href="https://github.com/rust-lang/compiler-team/issues/220" target="_blank" title="https://github.com/rust-lang/compiler-team/issues/220">compiler-team#220</a></li>
</ul>
</blockquote>
<p>what is up with this, <span class="user-mention" data-user-id="116083">@pnkfelix</span> ?</p>



<a name="184742197"></a>
<h4><a href="https://rust-lang.zulipchat.com#narrow/stream/131828-t-compiler/topic/planning%20meeting%202019.01.03/near/184742197" class="zl"><img src="https://rust-lang.github.io/zulip_archive/assets/img/zulip.svg" alt="view this post on Zulip" style="width:20px;height:20px;"></a> nikomatsakis <a href="https://rust-lang.github.io/zulip_archive/stream/131828-t-compiler/topic/planning.20meeting.202019.2E01.2E03.html#184742197">(Jan 03 2020 at 15:31)</a>:</h4>
<p>I feel like there was some discussion between you and <span class="user-mention" data-user-id="215333">@Florian Gilcher</span> ...?</p>



<a name="184742209"></a>
<h4><a href="https://rust-lang.zulipchat.com#narrow/stream/131828-t-compiler/topic/planning%20meeting%202019.01.03/near/184742209" class="zl"><img src="https://rust-lang.github.io/zulip_archive/assets/img/zulip.svg" alt="view this post on Zulip" style="width:20px;height:20px;"></a> pnkfelix <a href="https://rust-lang.github.io/zulip_archive/stream/131828-t-compiler/topic/planning.20meeting.202019.2E01.2E03.html#184742209">(Jan 03 2020 at 15:31)</a>:</h4>
<p>hmm, I don't know where we are on thart</p>



<a name="184742218"></a>
<h4><a href="https://rust-lang.zulipchat.com#narrow/stream/131828-t-compiler/topic/planning%20meeting%202019.01.03/near/184742218" class="zl"><img src="https://rust-lang.github.io/zulip_archive/assets/img/zulip.svg" alt="view this post on Zulip" style="width:20px;height:20px;"></a> nikomatsakis <a href="https://rust-lang.github.io/zulip_archive/stream/131828-t-compiler/topic/planning.20meeting.202019.2E01.2E03.html#184742218">(Jan 03 2020 at 15:31)</a>:</h4>
<p>and maybe we felt we don't need a meeting? (that's sort of what I remember)</p>



<a name="184742227"></a>
<h4><a href="https://rust-lang.zulipchat.com#narrow/stream/131828-t-compiler/topic/planning%20meeting%202019.01.03/near/184742227" class="zl"><img src="https://rust-lang.github.io/zulip_archive/assets/img/zulip.svg" alt="view this post on Zulip" style="width:20px;height:20px;"></a> pnkfelix <a href="https://rust-lang.github.io/zulip_archive/stream/131828-t-compiler/topic/planning.20meeting.202019.2E01.2E03.html#184742227">(Jan 03 2020 at 15:31)</a>:</h4>
<p>yeah, that is probably true</p>



<a name="184742277"></a>
<h4><a href="https://rust-lang.zulipchat.com#narrow/stream/131828-t-compiler/topic/planning%20meeting%202019.01.03/near/184742277" class="zl"><img src="https://rust-lang.github.io/zulip_archive/assets/img/zulip.svg" alt="view this post on Zulip" style="width:20px;height:20px;"></a> pnkfelix <a href="https://rust-lang.github.io/zulip_archive/stream/131828-t-compiler/topic/planning.20meeting.202019.2E01.2E03.html#184742277">(Jan 03 2020 at 15:32)</a>:</h4>
<p>we need to do the work, but the design meeting isn't the right place to assign that work</p>



<a name="184742298"></a>
<h4><a href="https://rust-lang.zulipchat.com#narrow/stream/131828-t-compiler/topic/planning%20meeting%202019.01.03/near/184742298" class="zl"><img src="https://rust-lang.github.io/zulip_archive/assets/img/zulip.svg" alt="view this post on Zulip" style="width:20px;height:20px;"></a> pnkfelix <a href="https://rust-lang.github.io/zulip_archive/stream/131828-t-compiler/topic/planning.20meeting.202019.2E01.2E03.html#184742298">(Jan 03 2020 at 15:32)</a>:</h4>
<p>and we'll need to send out notice of what the policies are</p>



<a name="184742315"></a>
<h4><a href="https://rust-lang.zulipchat.com#narrow/stream/131828-t-compiler/topic/planning%20meeting%202019.01.03/near/184742315" class="zl"><img src="https://rust-lang.github.io/zulip_archive/assets/img/zulip.svg" alt="view this post on Zulip" style="width:20px;height:20px;"></a> pnkfelix <a href="https://rust-lang.github.io/zulip_archive/stream/131828-t-compiler/topic/planning.20meeting.202019.2E01.2E03.html#184742315">(Jan 03 2020 at 15:32)</a>:</h4>
<p>but the question is whether <em>developing</em> the licensing policy belongs in this meeting</p>



<a name="184742322"></a>
<h4><a href="https://rust-lang.zulipchat.com#narrow/stream/131828-t-compiler/topic/planning%20meeting%202019.01.03/near/184742322" class="zl"><img src="https://rust-lang.github.io/zulip_archive/assets/img/zulip.svg" alt="view this post on Zulip" style="width:20px;height:20px;"></a> nikomatsakis <a href="https://rust-lang.github.io/zulip_archive/stream/131828-t-compiler/topic/planning.20meeting.202019.2E01.2E03.html#184742322">(Jan 03 2020 at 15:32)</a>:</h4>
<p>ok, maybe we should close it, or change the issue to a <a class="stream" data-stream-id="185694" href="/#narrow/stream/185694-t-compiler.2Fwg-meta">#t-compiler/wg-meta</a> issue</p>



<a name="184742338"></a>
<h4><a href="https://rust-lang.zulipchat.com#narrow/stream/131828-t-compiler/topic/planning%20meeting%202019.01.03/near/184742338" class="zl"><img src="https://rust-lang.github.io/zulip_archive/assets/img/zulip.svg" alt="view this post on Zulip" style="width:20px;height:20px;"></a> pnkfelix <a href="https://rust-lang.github.io/zulip_archive/stream/131828-t-compiler/topic/planning.20meeting.202019.2E01.2E03.html#184742338">(Jan 03 2020 at 15:33)</a>:</h4>
<p>okay</p>



<a name="184742344"></a>
<h4><a href="https://rust-lang.zulipchat.com#narrow/stream/131828-t-compiler/topic/planning%20meeting%202019.01.03/near/184742344" class="zl"><img src="https://rust-lang.github.io/zulip_archive/assets/img/zulip.svg" alt="view this post on Zulip" style="width:20px;height:20px;"></a> nikomatsakis <a href="https://rust-lang.github.io/zulip_archive/stream/131828-t-compiler/topic/planning.20meeting.202019.2E01.2E03.html#184742344">(Jan 03 2020 at 15:33)</a>:</h4>
<p>I feel like most people just kind of didn't care</p>



<a name="184742353"></a>
<h4><a href="https://rust-lang.zulipchat.com#narrow/stream/131828-t-compiler/topic/planning%20meeting%202019.01.03/near/184742353" class="zl"><img src="https://rust-lang.github.io/zulip_archive/assets/img/zulip.svg" alt="view this post on Zulip" style="width:20px;height:20px;"></a> nikomatsakis <a href="https://rust-lang.github.io/zulip_archive/stream/131828-t-compiler/topic/planning.20meeting.202019.2E01.2E03.html#184742353">(Jan 03 2020 at 15:33)</a>:</h4>
<p>I kind of don't care</p>



<a name="184742365"></a>
<h4><a href="https://rust-lang.zulipchat.com#narrow/stream/131828-t-compiler/topic/planning%20meeting%202019.01.03/near/184742365" class="zl"><img src="https://rust-lang.github.io/zulip_archive/assets/img/zulip.svg" alt="view this post on Zulip" style="width:20px;height:20px;"></a> nikomatsakis <a href="https://rust-lang.github.io/zulip_archive/stream/131828-t-compiler/topic/planning.20meeting.202019.2E01.2E03.html#184742365">(Jan 03 2020 at 15:33)</a>:</h4>
<p>well I mean I care that we have a policy and I'd sort of like to know what it is :)</p>



<a name="184742386"></a>
<h4><a href="https://rust-lang.zulipchat.com#narrow/stream/131828-t-compiler/topic/planning%20meeting%202019.01.03/near/184742386" class="zl"><img src="https://rust-lang.github.io/zulip_archive/assets/img/zulip.svg" alt="view this post on Zulip" style="width:20px;height:20px;"></a> nikomatsakis <a href="https://rust-lang.github.io/zulip_archive/stream/131828-t-compiler/topic/planning.20meeting.202019.2E01.2E03.html#184742386">(Jan 03 2020 at 15:33)</a>:</h4>
<p>but it seems like maybe we need to develop it and see if it seems tricky enough to be worth discussing as a group first...</p>



<a name="184742396"></a>
<h4><a href="https://rust-lang.zulipchat.com#narrow/stream/131828-t-compiler/topic/planning%20meeting%202019.01.03/near/184742396" class="zl"><img src="https://rust-lang.github.io/zulip_archive/assets/img/zulip.svg" alt="view this post on Zulip" style="width:20px;height:20px;"></a> centril <a href="https://rust-lang.github.io/zulip_archive/stream/131828-t-compiler/topic/planning.20meeting.202019.2E01.2E03.html#184742396">(Jan 03 2020 at 15:33)</a>:</h4>
<p>(If I had my druthers we'd be licensing under GPL3.0+, but given that we have a clear set of licenses to pick, I'm happy to just conform...)</p>



<a name="184742400"></a>
<h4><a href="https://rust-lang.zulipchat.com#narrow/stream/131828-t-compiler/topic/planning%20meeting%202019.01.03/near/184742400" class="zl"><img src="https://rust-lang.github.io/zulip_archive/assets/img/zulip.svg" alt="view this post on Zulip" style="width:20px;height:20px;"></a> nikomatsakis <a href="https://rust-lang.github.io/zulip_archive/stream/131828-t-compiler/topic/planning.20meeting.202019.2E01.2E03.html#184742400">(Jan 03 2020 at 15:34)</a>:</h4>
<p>(that's kind of what I thought the meeting would be when I opened it, so I thought we were basically arleady done with developing it?)</p>



<a name="184742402"></a>
<h4><a href="https://rust-lang.zulipchat.com#narrow/stream/131828-t-compiler/topic/planning%20meeting%202019.01.03/near/184742402" class="zl"><img src="https://rust-lang.github.io/zulip_archive/assets/img/zulip.svg" alt="view this post on Zulip" style="width:20px;height:20px;"></a> pnkfelix <a href="https://rust-lang.github.io/zulip_archive/stream/131828-t-compiler/topic/planning.20meeting.202019.2E01.2E03.html#184742402">(Jan 03 2020 at 15:34)</a>:</h4>
<p>the lack of caring is what i think has led to some violations that some people got worked up about</p>



<a name="184742461"></a>
<h4><a href="https://rust-lang.zulipchat.com#narrow/stream/131828-t-compiler/topic/planning%20meeting%202019.01.03/near/184742461" class="zl"><img src="https://rust-lang.github.io/zulip_archive/assets/img/zulip.svg" alt="view this post on Zulip" style="width:20px;height:20px;"></a> nikomatsakis <a href="https://rust-lang.github.io/zulip_archive/stream/131828-t-compiler/topic/planning.20meeting.202019.2E01.2E03.html#184742461">(Jan 03 2020 at 15:34)</a>:</h4>
<p>indeed</p>



<a name="184742472"></a>
<h4><a href="https://rust-lang.zulipchat.com#narrow/stream/131828-t-compiler/topic/planning%20meeting%202019.01.03/near/184742472" class="zl"><img src="https://rust-lang.github.io/zulip_archive/assets/img/zulip.svg" alt="view this post on Zulip" style="width:20px;height:20px;"></a> centril <a href="https://rust-lang.github.io/zulip_archive/stream/131828-t-compiler/topic/planning.20meeting.202019.2E01.2E03.html#184742472">(Jan 03 2020 at 15:34)</a>:</h4>
<p>I don't think we can force people to care</p>



<a name="184742497"></a>
<h4><a href="https://rust-lang.zulipchat.com#narrow/stream/131828-t-compiler/topic/planning%20meeting%202019.01.03/near/184742497" class="zl"><img src="https://rust-lang.github.io/zulip_archive/assets/img/zulip.svg" alt="view this post on Zulip" style="width:20px;height:20px;"></a> pnkfelix <a href="https://rust-lang.github.io/zulip_archive/stream/131828-t-compiler/topic/planning.20meeting.202019.2E01.2E03.html#184742497">(Jan 03 2020 at 15:34)</a>:</h4>
<p>we cannot force everyone to care</p>



<a name="184742499"></a>
<h4><a href="https://rust-lang.zulipchat.com#narrow/stream/131828-t-compiler/topic/planning%20meeting%202019.01.03/near/184742499" class="zl"><img src="https://rust-lang.github.io/zulip_archive/assets/img/zulip.svg" alt="view this post on Zulip" style="width:20px;height:20px;"></a> centril <a href="https://rust-lang.github.io/zulip_archive/stream/131828-t-compiler/topic/planning.20meeting.202019.2E01.2E03.html#184742499">(Jan 03 2020 at 15:34)</a>:</h4>
<p>(Other than via tooling and reviews)</p>



<a name="184742509"></a>
<h4><a href="https://rust-lang.zulipchat.com#narrow/stream/131828-t-compiler/topic/planning%20meeting%202019.01.03/near/184742509" class="zl"><img src="https://rust-lang.github.io/zulip_archive/assets/img/zulip.svg" alt="view this post on Zulip" style="width:20px;height:20px;"></a> pnkfelix <a href="https://rust-lang.github.io/zulip_archive/stream/131828-t-compiler/topic/planning.20meeting.202019.2E01.2E03.html#184742509">(Jan 03 2020 at 15:34)</a>:</h4>
<p>but we may need to force people with r+ privs to care</p>



<a name="184742513"></a>
<h4><a href="https://rust-lang.zulipchat.com#narrow/stream/131828-t-compiler/topic/planning%20meeting%202019.01.03/near/184742513" class="zl"><img src="https://rust-lang.github.io/zulip_archive/assets/img/zulip.svg" alt="view this post on Zulip" style="width:20px;height:20px;"></a> nikomatsakis <a href="https://rust-lang.github.io/zulip_archive/stream/131828-t-compiler/topic/planning.20meeting.202019.2E01.2E03.html#184742513">(Jan 03 2020 at 15:35)</a>:</h4>
<p>I think we can educate and answer questions</p>



<a name="184742531"></a>
<h4><a href="https://rust-lang.zulipchat.com#narrow/stream/131828-t-compiler/topic/planning%20meeting%202019.01.03/near/184742531" class="zl"><img src="https://rust-lang.github.io/zulip_archive/assets/img/zulip.svg" alt="view this post on Zulip" style="width:20px;height:20px;"></a> nikomatsakis <a href="https://rust-lang.github.io/zulip_archive/stream/131828-t-compiler/topic/planning.20meeting.202019.2E01.2E03.html#184742531">(Jan 03 2020 at 15:35)</a>:</h4>
<p>I guess when I say I don't care what I mean is</p>



<a name="184742537"></a>
<h4><a href="https://rust-lang.zulipchat.com#narrow/stream/131828-t-compiler/topic/planning%20meeting%202019.01.03/near/184742537" class="zl"><img src="https://rust-lang.github.io/zulip_archive/assets/img/zulip.svg" alt="view this post on Zulip" style="width:20px;height:20px;"></a> nikomatsakis <a href="https://rust-lang.github.io/zulip_archive/stream/131828-t-compiler/topic/planning.20meeting.202019.2E01.2E03.html#184742537">(Jan 03 2020 at 15:35)</a>:</h4>
<p>I just want to be told what to do</p>



<a name="184742540"></a>
<h4><a href="https://rust-lang.zulipchat.com#narrow/stream/131828-t-compiler/topic/planning%20meeting%202019.01.03/near/184742540" class="zl"><img src="https://rust-lang.github.io/zulip_archive/assets/img/zulip.svg" alt="view this post on Zulip" style="width:20px;height:20px;"></a> pnkfelix <a href="https://rust-lang.github.io/zulip_archive/stream/131828-t-compiler/topic/planning.20meeting.202019.2E01.2E03.html#184742540">(Jan 03 2020 at 15:35)</a>:</h4>
<p>okay yes</p>



<a name="184742550"></a>
<h4><a href="https://rust-lang.zulipchat.com#narrow/stream/131828-t-compiler/topic/planning%20meeting%202019.01.03/near/184742550" class="zl"><img src="https://rust-lang.github.io/zulip_archive/assets/img/zulip.svg" alt="view this post on Zulip" style="width:20px;height:20px;"></a> pnkfelix <a href="https://rust-lang.github.io/zulip_archive/stream/131828-t-compiler/topic/planning.20meeting.202019.2E01.2E03.html#184742550">(Jan 03 2020 at 15:35)</a>:</h4>
<p>that's an important distinction</p>



<a name="184742620"></a>
<h4><a href="https://rust-lang.zulipchat.com#narrow/stream/131828-t-compiler/topic/planning%20meeting%202019.01.03/near/184742620" class="zl"><img src="https://rust-lang.github.io/zulip_archive/assets/img/zulip.svg" alt="view this post on Zulip" style="width:20px;height:20px;"></a> nikomatsakis <a href="https://rust-lang.github.io/zulip_archive/stream/131828-t-compiler/topic/planning.20meeting.202019.2E01.2E03.html#184742620">(Jan 03 2020 at 15:36)</a>:</h4>
<p>so I think a meeting with that goal would be good, but it sounds like we're not quite ready for that</p>



<a name="184742622"></a>
<h4><a href="https://rust-lang.zulipchat.com#narrow/stream/131828-t-compiler/topic/planning%20meeting%202019.01.03/near/184742622" class="zl"><img src="https://rust-lang.github.io/zulip_archive/assets/img/zulip.svg" alt="view this post on Zulip" style="width:20px;height:20px;"></a> nikomatsakis <a href="https://rust-lang.github.io/zulip_archive/stream/131828-t-compiler/topic/planning.20meeting.202019.2E01.2E03.html#184742622">(Jan 03 2020 at 15:36)</a>:</h4>
<p>though I'm not sure how far we are fr it</p>



<a name="184742630"></a>
<h4><a href="https://rust-lang.zulipchat.com#narrow/stream/131828-t-compiler/topic/planning%20meeting%202019.01.03/near/184742630" class="zl"><img src="https://rust-lang.github.io/zulip_archive/assets/img/zulip.svg" alt="view this post on Zulip" style="width:20px;height:20px;"></a> nikomatsakis <a href="https://rust-lang.github.io/zulip_archive/stream/131828-t-compiler/topic/planning.20meeting.202019.2E01.2E03.html#184742630">(Jan 03 2020 at 15:36)</a>:</h4>
<p>(I would also expect that we may uncover some practical challenges that would require minor revisions)</p>



<a name="184742634"></a>
<h4><a href="https://rust-lang.zulipchat.com#narrow/stream/131828-t-compiler/topic/planning%20meeting%202019.01.03/near/184742634" class="zl"><img src="https://rust-lang.github.io/zulip_archive/assets/img/zulip.svg" alt="view this post on Zulip" style="width:20px;height:20px;"></a> centril <a href="https://rust-lang.github.io/zulip_archive/stream/131828-t-compiler/topic/planning.20meeting.202019.2E01.2E03.html#184742634">(Jan 03 2020 at 15:36)</a>:</h4>
<p>would the meeting just communicate what to do?</p>



<a name="184742642"></a>
<h4><a href="https://rust-lang.zulipchat.com#narrow/stream/131828-t-compiler/topic/planning%20meeting%202019.01.03/near/184742642" class="zl"><img src="https://rust-lang.github.io/zulip_archive/assets/img/zulip.svg" alt="view this post on Zulip" style="width:20px;height:20px;"></a> centril <a href="https://rust-lang.github.io/zulip_archive/stream/131828-t-compiler/topic/planning.20meeting.202019.2E01.2E03.html#184742642">(Jan 03 2020 at 15:36)</a>:</h4>
<p>or should the meeting design what to do?</p>



<a name="184742657"></a>
<h4><a href="https://rust-lang.zulipchat.com#narrow/stream/131828-t-compiler/topic/planning%20meeting%202019.01.03/near/184742657" class="zl"><img src="https://rust-lang.github.io/zulip_archive/assets/img/zulip.svg" alt="view this post on Zulip" style="width:20px;height:20px;"></a> pnkfelix <a href="https://rust-lang.github.io/zulip_archive/stream/131828-t-compiler/topic/planning.20meeting.202019.2E01.2E03.html#184742657">(Jan 03 2020 at 15:37)</a>:</h4>
<p>I think a number of people have argued that an email is better than a meeting for the step of dictating what to do</p>



<a name="184742664"></a>
<h4><a href="https://rust-lang.zulipchat.com#narrow/stream/131828-t-compiler/topic/planning%20meeting%202019.01.03/near/184742664" class="zl"><img src="https://rust-lang.github.io/zulip_archive/assets/img/zulip.svg" alt="view this post on Zulip" style="width:20px;height:20px;"></a> centril <a href="https://rust-lang.github.io/zulip_archive/stream/131828-t-compiler/topic/planning.20meeting.202019.2E01.2E03.html#184742664">(Jan 03 2020 at 15:37)</a>:</h4>
<p>I feel an email is more appropriate for the former, a meeting for the latter</p>



<a name="184742675"></a>
<h4><a href="https://rust-lang.zulipchat.com#narrow/stream/131828-t-compiler/topic/planning%20meeting%202019.01.03/near/184742675" class="zl"><img src="https://rust-lang.github.io/zulip_archive/assets/img/zulip.svg" alt="view this post on Zulip" style="width:20px;height:20px;"></a> centril <a href="https://rust-lang.github.io/zulip_archive/stream/131828-t-compiler/topic/planning.20meeting.202019.2E01.2E03.html#184742675">(Jan 03 2020 at 15:37)</a>:</h4>
<p><span class="user-mention" data-user-id="116083">@pnkfelix</span>  you have quick fingers =P</p>



<a name="184742678"></a>
<h4><a href="https://rust-lang.zulipchat.com#narrow/stream/131828-t-compiler/topic/planning%20meeting%202019.01.03/near/184742678" class="zl"><img src="https://rust-lang.github.io/zulip_archive/assets/img/zulip.svg" alt="view this post on Zulip" style="width:20px;height:20px;"></a> nikomatsakis <a href="https://rust-lang.github.io/zulip_archive/stream/131828-t-compiler/topic/planning.20meeting.202019.2E01.2E03.html#184742678">(Jan 03 2020 at 15:37)</a>:</h4>
<p>well, I was imagining that there would be questions</p>



<a name="184742681"></a>
<h4><a href="https://rust-lang.zulipchat.com#narrow/stream/131828-t-compiler/topic/planning%20meeting%202019.01.03/near/184742681" class="zl"><img src="https://rust-lang.github.io/zulip_archive/assets/img/zulip.svg" alt="view this post on Zulip" style="width:20px;height:20px;"></a> pnkfelix <a href="https://rust-lang.github.io/zulip_archive/stream/131828-t-compiler/topic/planning.20meeting.202019.2E01.2E03.html#184742681">(Jan 03 2020 at 15:37)</a>:</h4>
<p>and I think the meeting to design what to do is probably better done with a smaller group of "expderts', what ever that means</p>



<a name="184742683"></a>
<h4><a href="https://rust-lang.zulipchat.com#narrow/stream/131828-t-compiler/topic/planning%20meeting%202019.01.03/near/184742683" class="zl"><img src="https://rust-lang.github.io/zulip_archive/assets/img/zulip.svg" alt="view this post on Zulip" style="width:20px;height:20px;"></a> nikomatsakis <a href="https://rust-lang.github.io/zulip_archive/stream/131828-t-compiler/topic/planning.20meeting.202019.2E01.2E03.html#184742683">(Jan 03 2020 at 15:37)</a>:</h4>
<p>I also don't think people will read the e-mail, but maybe I'm projecting :)</p>



<a name="184742691"></a>
<h4><a href="https://rust-lang.zulipchat.com#narrow/stream/131828-t-compiler/topic/planning%20meeting%202019.01.03/near/184742691" class="zl"><img src="https://rust-lang.github.io/zulip_archive/assets/img/zulip.svg" alt="view this post on Zulip" style="width:20px;height:20px;"></a> pnkfelix <a href="https://rust-lang.github.io/zulip_archive/stream/131828-t-compiler/topic/planning.20meeting.202019.2E01.2E03.html#184742691">(Jan 03 2020 at 15:37)</a>:</h4>
<blockquote>
<p>I also don't think people will read the e-mail, but maybe I'm projecting :)</p>
</blockquote>
<p>this was my reaction as well.</p>



<a name="184742694"></a>
<h4><a href="https://rust-lang.zulipchat.com#narrow/stream/131828-t-compiler/topic/planning%20meeting%202019.01.03/near/184742694" class="zl"><img src="https://rust-lang.github.io/zulip_archive/assets/img/zulip.svg" alt="view this post on Zulip" style="width:20px;height:20px;"></a> nikomatsakis <a href="https://rust-lang.github.io/zulip_archive/stream/131828-t-compiler/topic/planning.20meeting.202019.2E01.2E03.html#184742694">(Jan 03 2020 at 15:37)</a>:</h4>
<p>but I'm game to try and e-mail first</p>



<a name="184742704"></a>
<h4><a href="https://rust-lang.zulipchat.com#narrow/stream/131828-t-compiler/topic/planning%20meeting%202019.01.03/near/184742704" class="zl"><img src="https://rust-lang.github.io/zulip_archive/assets/img/zulip.svg" alt="view this post on Zulip" style="width:20px;height:20px;"></a> pnkfelix <a href="https://rust-lang.github.io/zulip_archive/stream/131828-t-compiler/topic/planning.20meeting.202019.2E01.2E03.html#184742704">(Jan 03 2020 at 15:37)</a>:</h4>
<p>we probably need to broadcast on multiple channels, to be honest</p>



<a name="184742712"></a>
<h4><a href="https://rust-lang.zulipchat.com#narrow/stream/131828-t-compiler/topic/planning%20meeting%202019.01.03/near/184742712" class="zl"><img src="https://rust-lang.github.io/zulip_archive/assets/img/zulip.svg" alt="view this post on Zulip" style="width:20px;height:20px;"></a> nikomatsakis <a href="https://rust-lang.github.io/zulip_archive/stream/131828-t-compiler/topic/planning.20meeting.202019.2E01.2E03.html#184742712">(Jan 03 2020 at 15:38)</a>:</h4>
<p>at least I think we need something that can <em>be</em> e-mailed first</p>



<a name="184742749"></a>
<h4><a href="https://rust-lang.zulipchat.com#narrow/stream/131828-t-compiler/topic/planning%20meeting%202019.01.03/near/184742749" class="zl"><img src="https://rust-lang.github.io/zulip_archive/assets/img/zulip.svg" alt="view this post on Zulip" style="width:20px;height:20px;"></a> centril <a href="https://rust-lang.github.io/zulip_archive/stream/131828-t-compiler/topic/planning.20meeting.202019.2E01.2E03.html#184742749">(Jan 03 2020 at 15:38)</a>:</h4>
<p><span class="user-mention" data-user-id="116009">@nikomatsakis</span> not everyone has as many unread emails as you ;)</p>



<a name="184742756"></a>
<h4><a href="https://rust-lang.zulipchat.com#narrow/stream/131828-t-compiler/topic/planning%20meeting%202019.01.03/near/184742756" class="zl"><img src="https://rust-lang.github.io/zulip_archive/assets/img/zulip.svg" alt="view this post on Zulip" style="width:20px;height:20px;"></a> pnkfelix <a href="https://rust-lang.github.io/zulip_archive/stream/131828-t-compiler/topic/planning.20meeting.202019.2E01.2E03.html#184742756">(Jan 03 2020 at 15:38)</a>:</h4>
<p>but maybe email + announcement at thursday meeting would suffice.</p>



<a name="184742786"></a>
<h4><a href="https://rust-lang.zulipchat.com#narrow/stream/131828-t-compiler/topic/planning%20meeting%202019.01.03/near/184742786" class="zl"><img src="https://rust-lang.github.io/zulip_archive/assets/img/zulip.svg" alt="view this post on Zulip" style="width:20px;height:20px;"></a> nikomatsakis <a href="https://rust-lang.github.io/zulip_archive/stream/131828-t-compiler/topic/planning.20meeting.202019.2E01.2E03.html#184742786">(Jan 03 2020 at 15:38)</a>:</h4>
<p>ok. Shoud we close meeting proposa for now? (move to wg-meta as a thing we need to get done)</p>



<a name="184742789"></a>
<h4><a href="https://rust-lang.zulipchat.com#narrow/stream/131828-t-compiler/topic/planning%20meeting%202019.01.03/near/184742789" class="zl"><img src="https://rust-lang.github.io/zulip_archive/assets/img/zulip.svg" alt="view this post on Zulip" style="width:20px;height:20px;"></a> nikomatsakis <a href="https://rust-lang.github.io/zulip_archive/stream/131828-t-compiler/topic/planning.20meeting.202019.2E01.2E03.html#184742789">(Jan 03 2020 at 15:38)</a>:</h4>
<p>sonds like yes</p>



<a name="184742801"></a>
<h4><a href="https://rust-lang.zulipchat.com#narrow/stream/131828-t-compiler/topic/planning%20meeting%202019.01.03/near/184742801" class="zl"><img src="https://rust-lang.github.io/zulip_archive/assets/img/zulip.svg" alt="view this post on Zulip" style="width:20px;height:20px;"></a> nikomatsakis <a href="https://rust-lang.github.io/zulip_archive/stream/131828-t-compiler/topic/planning.20meeting.202019.2E01.2E03.html#184742801">(Jan 03 2020 at 15:38)</a>:</h4>
<p>I want to close out some of these long-standing open ones</p>



<a name="184742802"></a>
<h4><a href="https://rust-lang.zulipchat.com#narrow/stream/131828-t-compiler/topic/planning%20meeting%202019.01.03/near/184742802" class="zl"><img src="https://rust-lang.github.io/zulip_archive/assets/img/zulip.svg" alt="view this post on Zulip" style="width:20px;height:20px;"></a> pnkfelix <a href="https://rust-lang.github.io/zulip_archive/stream/131828-t-compiler/topic/planning.20meeting.202019.2E01.2E03.html#184742802">(Jan 03 2020 at 15:38)</a>:</h4>
<p>yeah moving to wg-meta sounds fine</p>



<a name="184742809"></a>
<h4><a href="https://rust-lang.zulipchat.com#narrow/stream/131828-t-compiler/topic/planning%20meeting%202019.01.03/near/184742809" class="zl"><img src="https://rust-lang.github.io/zulip_archive/assets/img/zulip.svg" alt="view this post on Zulip" style="width:20px;height:20px;"></a> pnkfelix <a href="https://rust-lang.github.io/zulip_archive/stream/131828-t-compiler/topic/planning.20meeting.202019.2E01.2E03.html#184742809">(Jan 03 2020 at 15:38)</a>:</h4>
<p>/me needs to join wg-meta probably.</p>



<a name="184742833"></a>
<h4><a href="https://rust-lang.zulipchat.com#narrow/stream/131828-t-compiler/topic/planning%20meeting%202019.01.03/near/184742833" class="zl"><img src="https://rust-lang.github.io/zulip_archive/assets/img/zulip.svg" alt="view this post on Zulip" style="width:20px;height:20px;"></a> nikomatsakis <a href="https://rust-lang.github.io/zulip_archive/stream/131828-t-compiler/topic/planning.20meeting.202019.2E01.2E03.html#184742833">(Jan 03 2020 at 15:39)</a>:</h4>
<p>we've been kind of dormant for a month or two but it seems like we're getting more and more stuff to do..</p>



<a name="184742862"></a>
<h4><a href="https://rust-lang.zulipchat.com#narrow/stream/131828-t-compiler/topic/planning%20meeting%202019.01.03/near/184742862" class="zl"><img src="https://rust-lang.github.io/zulip_archive/assets/img/zulip.svg" alt="view this post on Zulip" style="width:20px;height:20px;"></a> nikomatsakis <a href="https://rust-lang.github.io/zulip_archive/stream/131828-t-compiler/topic/planning.20meeting.202019.2E01.2E03.html#184742862">(Jan 03 2020 at 15:39)</a>:</h4>
<p>maybe we can talk a bit about </p>
<blockquote>
<p>design of the chalk-ty library <a href="https://github.com/rust-lang/compiler-team/issues/234" target="_blank" title="https://github.com/rust-lang/compiler-team/issues/234">compiler-team#234</a></p>
</blockquote>



<a name="184742874"></a>
<h4><a href="https://rust-lang.zulipchat.com#narrow/stream/131828-t-compiler/topic/planning%20meeting%202019.01.03/near/184742874" class="zl"><img src="https://rust-lang.github.io/zulip_archive/assets/img/zulip.svg" alt="view this post on Zulip" style="width:20px;height:20px;"></a> nikomatsakis <a href="https://rust-lang.github.io/zulip_archive/stream/131828-t-compiler/topic/planning.20meeting.202019.2E01.2E03.html#184742874">(Jan 03 2020 at 15:39)</a>:</h4>
<p>I'm curious about best way to give/get feedback around "library-ification" designs</p>



<a name="184742952"></a>
<h4><a href="https://rust-lang.zulipchat.com#narrow/stream/131828-t-compiler/topic/planning%20meeting%202019.01.03/near/184742952" class="zl"><img src="https://rust-lang.github.io/zulip_archive/assets/img/zulip.svg" alt="view this post on Zulip" style="width:20px;height:20px;"></a> mw <a href="https://rust-lang.github.io/zulip_archive/stream/131828-t-compiler/topic/planning.20meeting.202019.2E01.2E03.html#184742952">(Jan 03 2020 at 15:40)</a>:</h4>
<p>I was thinking that there are probably certain patterns that emerge here</p>



<a name="184742960"></a>
<h4><a href="https://rust-lang.zulipchat.com#narrow/stream/131828-t-compiler/topic/planning%20meeting%202019.01.03/near/184742960" class="zl"><img src="https://rust-lang.github.io/zulip_archive/assets/img/zulip.svg" alt="view this post on Zulip" style="width:20px;height:20px;"></a> nikomatsakis <a href="https://rust-lang.github.io/zulip_archive/stream/131828-t-compiler/topic/planning.20meeting.202019.2E01.2E03.html#184742960">(Jan 03 2020 at 15:40)</a>:</h4>
<p>the design here isn't fully written out yet, but I think it's becoming <em>fairly</em> clear -- so I'm trying to decide what makes the most sense -- I could see trying to finish up docs and bringing it to a meeting to talk about, not sure how much code to write beforehand :)</p>



<a name="184742962"></a>
<h4><a href="https://rust-lang.zulipchat.com#narrow/stream/131828-t-compiler/topic/planning%20meeting%202019.01.03/near/184742962" class="zl"><img src="https://rust-lang.github.io/zulip_archive/assets/img/zulip.svg" alt="view this post on Zulip" style="width:20px;height:20px;"></a> mw <a href="https://rust-lang.github.io/zulip_archive/stream/131828-t-compiler/topic/planning.20meeting.202019.2E01.2E03.html#184742962">(Jan 03 2020 at 15:40)</a>:</h4>
<p>i.e. how to set up code</p>



<a name="184742963"></a>
<h4><a href="https://rust-lang.zulipchat.com#narrow/stream/131828-t-compiler/topic/planning%20meeting%202019.01.03/near/184742963" class="zl"><img src="https://rust-lang.github.io/zulip_archive/assets/img/zulip.svg" alt="view this post on Zulip" style="width:20px;height:20px;"></a> centril <a href="https://rust-lang.github.io/zulip_archive/stream/131828-t-compiler/topic/planning.20meeting.202019.2E01.2E03.html#184742963">(Jan 03 2020 at 15:40)</a>:</h4>
<p>(<code>TypeFamily</code> -- not loving that name... it feels confusable with <a href="https://wiki.haskell.org/GHC/Type_families" target="_blank" title="https://wiki.haskell.org/GHC/Type_families">https://wiki.haskell.org/GHC/Type_families</a>)</p>



<a name="184742969"></a>
<h4><a href="https://rust-lang.zulipchat.com#narrow/stream/131828-t-compiler/topic/planning%20meeting%202019.01.03/near/184742969" class="zl"><img src="https://rust-lang.github.io/zulip_archive/assets/img/zulip.svg" alt="view this post on Zulip" style="width:20px;height:20px;"></a> nikomatsakis <a href="https://rust-lang.github.io/zulip_archive/stream/131828-t-compiler/topic/planning.20meeting.202019.2E01.2E03.html#184742969">(Jan 03 2020 at 15:40)</a>:</h4>
<p>(I don't like the name either)</p>



<a name="184742988"></a>
<h4><a href="https://rust-lang.zulipchat.com#narrow/stream/131828-t-compiler/topic/planning%20meeting%202019.01.03/near/184742988" class="zl"><img src="https://rust-lang.github.io/zulip_archive/assets/img/zulip.svg" alt="view this post on Zulip" style="width:20px;height:20px;"></a> nikomatsakis <a href="https://rust-lang.github.io/zulip_archive/stream/131828-t-compiler/topic/planning.20meeting.202019.2E01.2E03.html#184742988">(Jan 03 2020 at 15:41)</a>:</h4>
<blockquote>
<p>i.e. how to set up code</p>
</blockquote>
<p>do you mean like "poly vs monorepo"?</p>



<a name="184742990"></a>
<h4><a href="https://rust-lang.zulipchat.com#narrow/stream/131828-t-compiler/topic/planning%20meeting%202019.01.03/near/184742990" class="zl"><img src="https://rust-lang.github.io/zulip_archive/assets/img/zulip.svg" alt="view this post on Zulip" style="width:20px;height:20px;"></a> nikomatsakis <a href="https://rust-lang.github.io/zulip_archive/stream/131828-t-compiler/topic/planning.20meeting.202019.2E01.2E03.html#184742990">(Jan 03 2020 at 15:41)</a>:</h4>
<p>or crate structure?</p>



<a name="184742991"></a>
<h4><a href="https://rust-lang.zulipchat.com#narrow/stream/131828-t-compiler/topic/planning%20meeting%202019.01.03/near/184742991" class="zl"><img src="https://rust-lang.github.io/zulip_archive/assets/img/zulip.svg" alt="view this post on Zulip" style="width:20px;height:20px;"></a> nikomatsakis <a href="https://rust-lang.github.io/zulip_archive/stream/131828-t-compiler/topic/planning.20meeting.202019.2E01.2E03.html#184742991">(Jan 03 2020 at 15:41)</a>:</h4>
<p>or both? :)</p>



<a name="184743014"></a>
<h4><a href="https://rust-lang.zulipchat.com#narrow/stream/131828-t-compiler/topic/planning%20meeting%202019.01.03/near/184743014" class="zl"><img src="https://rust-lang.github.io/zulip_archive/assets/img/zulip.svg" alt="view this post on Zulip" style="width:20px;height:20px;"></a> mw <a href="https://rust-lang.github.io/zulip_archive/stream/131828-t-compiler/topic/planning.20meeting.202019.2E01.2E03.html#184743014">(Jan 03 2020 at 15:41)</a>:</h4>
<p>crate structure, splitting things into traits, having something like traits that get further and further refined</p>



<a name="184743046"></a>
<h4><a href="https://rust-lang.zulipchat.com#narrow/stream/131828-t-compiler/topic/planning%20meeting%202019.01.03/near/184743046" class="zl"><img src="https://rust-lang.github.io/zulip_archive/assets/img/zulip.svg" alt="view this post on Zulip" style="width:20px;height:20px;"></a> centril <a href="https://rust-lang.github.io/zulip_archive/stream/131828-t-compiler/topic/planning.20meeting.202019.2E01.2E03.html#184743046">(Jan 03 2020 at 15:42)</a>:</h4>
<p>(From the discussions thus far re. mono vs. polyrepo I think we've been going with the former)</p>



<a name="184743061"></a>
<h4><a href="https://rust-lang.zulipchat.com#narrow/stream/131828-t-compiler/topic/planning%20meeting%202019.01.03/near/184743061" class="zl"><img src="https://rust-lang.github.io/zulip_archive/assets/img/zulip.svg" alt="view this post on Zulip" style="width:20px;height:20px;"></a> mw <a href="https://rust-lang.github.io/zulip_archive/stream/131828-t-compiler/topic/planning.20meeting.202019.2E01.2E03.html#184743061">(Jan 03 2020 at 15:42)</a>:</h4>
<p>things like that</p>



<a name="184743080"></a>
<h4><a href="https://rust-lang.zulipchat.com#narrow/stream/131828-t-compiler/topic/planning%20meeting%202019.01.03/near/184743080" class="zl"><img src="https://rust-lang.github.io/zulip_archive/assets/img/zulip.svg" alt="view this post on Zulip" style="width:20px;height:20px;"></a> pnkfelix <a href="https://rust-lang.github.io/zulip_archive/stream/131828-t-compiler/topic/planning.20meeting.202019.2E01.2E03.html#184743080">(Jan 03 2020 at 15:42)</a>:</h4>
<p>so <span class="user-mention" data-user-id="116009">@nikomatsakis</span> , before we dive further into details of the chalk-ty topic itself</p>



<a name="184743085"></a>
<h4><a href="https://rust-lang.zulipchat.com#narrow/stream/131828-t-compiler/topic/planning%20meeting%202019.01.03/near/184743085" class="zl"><img src="https://rust-lang.github.io/zulip_archive/assets/img/zulip.svg" alt="view this post on Zulip" style="width:20px;height:20px;"></a> pnkfelix <a href="https://rust-lang.github.io/zulip_archive/stream/131828-t-compiler/topic/planning.20meeting.202019.2E01.2E03.html#184743085">(Jan 03 2020 at 15:42)</a>:</h4>
<p>since it is the only meeting proposal left</p>



<a name="184743100"></a>
<h4><a href="https://rust-lang.zulipchat.com#narrow/stream/131828-t-compiler/topic/planning%20meeting%202019.01.03/near/184743100" class="zl"><img src="https://rust-lang.github.io/zulip_archive/assets/img/zulip.svg" alt="view this post on Zulip" style="width:20px;height:20px;"></a> pnkfelix <a href="https://rust-lang.github.io/zulip_archive/stream/131828-t-compiler/topic/planning.20meeting.202019.2E01.2E03.html#184743100">(Jan 03 2020 at 15:42)</a>:</h4>
<p>(right?)</p>



<a name="184743123"></a>
<h4><a href="https://rust-lang.zulipchat.com#narrow/stream/131828-t-compiler/topic/planning%20meeting%202019.01.03/near/184743123" class="zl"><img src="https://rust-lang.github.io/zulip_archive/assets/img/zulip.svg" alt="view this post on Zulip" style="width:20px;height:20px;"></a> pnkfelix <a href="https://rust-lang.github.io/zulip_archive/stream/131828-t-compiler/topic/planning.20meeting.202019.2E01.2E03.html#184743123">(Jan 03 2020 at 15:43)</a>:</h4>
<p>and we were at some point discussing the matter of the "next" planning meeting being scheduled for Jan 17th</p>



<a name="184743128"></a>
<h4><a href="https://rust-lang.zulipchat.com#narrow/stream/131828-t-compiler/topic/planning%20meeting%202019.01.03/near/184743128" class="zl"><img src="https://rust-lang.github.io/zulip_archive/assets/img/zulip.svg" alt="view this post on Zulip" style="width:20px;height:20px;"></a> pnkfelix <a href="https://rust-lang.github.io/zulip_archive/stream/131828-t-compiler/topic/planning.20meeting.202019.2E01.2E03.html#184743128">(Jan 03 2020 at 15:43)</a>:</h4>
<p>would it be realistic to allocate Jan 10th for the chalk-ty meeting?</p>



<a name="184743137"></a>
<h4><a href="https://rust-lang.zulipchat.com#narrow/stream/131828-t-compiler/topic/planning%20meeting%202019.01.03/near/184743137" class="zl"><img src="https://rust-lang.github.io/zulip_archive/assets/img/zulip.svg" alt="view this post on Zulip" style="width:20px;height:20px;"></a> nikomatsakis <a href="https://rust-lang.github.io/zulip_archive/stream/131828-t-compiler/topic/planning.20meeting.202019.2E01.2E03.html#184743137">(Jan 03 2020 at 15:43)</a>:</h4>
<blockquote>
<ul>
<li>Maintenance and triage meeting-proposal <a href="https://github.com/rust-lang/compiler-team/issues/90" target="_blank" title="https://github.com/rust-lang/compiler-team/issues/90">compiler-team#90</a></li>
</ul>
</blockquote>
<p>this one maybe</p>



<a name="184743142"></a>
<h4><a href="https://rust-lang.zulipchat.com#narrow/stream/131828-t-compiler/topic/planning%20meeting%202019.01.03/near/184743142" class="zl"><img src="https://rust-lang.github.io/zulip_archive/assets/img/zulip.svg" alt="view this post on Zulip" style="width:20px;height:20px;"></a> pnkfelix <a href="https://rust-lang.github.io/zulip_archive/stream/131828-t-compiler/topic/planning.20meeting.202019.2E01.2E03.html#184743142">(Jan 03 2020 at 15:43)</a>:</h4>
<p>(do you think you'd have everything put together in time?)</p>



<a name="184743144"></a>
<h4><a href="https://rust-lang.zulipchat.com#narrow/stream/131828-t-compiler/topic/planning%20meeting%202019.01.03/near/184743144" class="zl"><img src="https://rust-lang.github.io/zulip_archive/assets/img/zulip.svg" alt="view this post on Zulip" style="width:20px;height:20px;"></a> nikomatsakis <a href="https://rust-lang.github.io/zulip_archive/stream/131828-t-compiler/topic/planning.20meeting.202019.2E01.2E03.html#184743144">(Jan 03 2020 at 15:43)</a>:</h4>
<blockquote>
<p>would it be realistic to allocate Jan 10th for the chalk-ty meeting?</p>
</blockquote>
<p>depends I guess</p>



<a name="184743150"></a>
<h4><a href="https://rust-lang.zulipchat.com#narrow/stream/131828-t-compiler/topic/planning%20meeting%202019.01.03/near/184743150" class="zl"><img src="https://rust-lang.github.io/zulip_archive/assets/img/zulip.svg" alt="view this post on Zulip" style="width:20px;height:20px;"></a> nikomatsakis <a href="https://rust-lang.github.io/zulip_archive/stream/131828-t-compiler/topic/planning.20meeting.202019.2E01.2E03.html#184743150">(Jan 03 2020 at 15:43)</a>:</h4>
<p>what "everything" is</p>



<a name="184743161"></a>
<h4><a href="https://rust-lang.zulipchat.com#narrow/stream/131828-t-compiler/topic/planning%20meeting%202019.01.03/near/184743161" class="zl"><img src="https://rust-lang.github.io/zulip_archive/assets/img/zulip.svg" alt="view this post on Zulip" style="width:20px;height:20px;"></a> pnkfelix <a href="https://rust-lang.github.io/zulip_archive/stream/131828-t-compiler/topic/planning.20meeting.202019.2E01.2E03.html#184743161">(Jan 03 2020 at 15:43)</a>:</h4>
<p>Oh I guess there was <a href="https://github.com/rust-lang/compiler-team/issues/90" target="_blank" title="https://github.com/rust-lang/compiler-team/issues/90">compiler-team#90</a> too, true</p>



<a name="184743163"></a>
<h4><a href="https://rust-lang.zulipchat.com#narrow/stream/131828-t-compiler/topic/planning%20meeting%202019.01.03/near/184743163" class="zl"><img src="https://rust-lang.github.io/zulip_archive/assets/img/zulip.svg" alt="view this post on Zulip" style="width:20px;height:20px;"></a> nikomatsakis <a href="https://rust-lang.github.io/zulip_archive/stream/131828-t-compiler/topic/planning.20meeting.202019.2E01.2E03.html#184743163">(Jan 03 2020 at 15:43)</a>:</h4>
<p>I think I could do a bit more writing up, but it'd be pretty "early"</p>



<a name="184743167"></a>
<h4><a href="https://rust-lang.zulipchat.com#narrow/stream/131828-t-compiler/topic/planning%20meeting%202019.01.03/near/184743167" class="zl"><img src="https://rust-lang.github.io/zulip_archive/assets/img/zulip.svg" alt="view this post on Zulip" style="width:20px;height:20px;"></a> nikomatsakis <a href="https://rust-lang.github.io/zulip_archive/stream/131828-t-compiler/topic/planning.20meeting.202019.2E01.2E03.html#184743167">(Jan 03 2020 at 15:43)</a>:</h4>
<p>but that's maybe ok</p>



<a name="184743169"></a>
<h4><a href="https://rust-lang.zulipchat.com#narrow/stream/131828-t-compiler/topic/planning%20meeting%202019.01.03/near/184743169" class="zl"><img src="https://rust-lang.github.io/zulip_archive/assets/img/zulip.svg" alt="view this post on Zulip" style="width:20px;height:20px;"></a> pnkfelix <a href="https://rust-lang.github.io/zulip_archive/stream/131828-t-compiler/topic/planning.20meeting.202019.2E01.2E03.html#184743169">(Jan 03 2020 at 15:44)</a>:</h4>
<p>okay, well</p>



<a name="184743212"></a>
<h4><a href="https://rust-lang.zulipchat.com#narrow/stream/131828-t-compiler/topic/planning%20meeting%202019.01.03/near/184743212" class="zl"><img src="https://rust-lang.github.io/zulip_archive/assets/img/zulip.svg" alt="view this post on Zulip" style="width:20px;height:20px;"></a> pnkfelix <a href="https://rust-lang.github.io/zulip_archive/stream/131828-t-compiler/topic/planning.20meeting.202019.2E01.2E03.html#184743212">(Jan 03 2020 at 15:44)</a>:</h4>
<p>if its too soon</p>



<a name="184743224"></a>
<h4><a href="https://rust-lang.zulipchat.com#narrow/stream/131828-t-compiler/topic/planning%20meeting%202019.01.03/near/184743224" class="zl"><img src="https://rust-lang.github.io/zulip_archive/assets/img/zulip.svg" alt="view this post on Zulip" style="width:20px;height:20px;"></a> pnkfelix <a href="https://rust-lang.github.io/zulip_archive/stream/131828-t-compiler/topic/planning.20meeting.202019.2E01.2E03.html#184743224">(Jan 03 2020 at 15:44)</a>:</h4>
<p>then maybe we should indeed just cancel next weeks design meeting</p>



<a name="184743232"></a>
<h4><a href="https://rust-lang.zulipchat.com#narrow/stream/131828-t-compiler/topic/planning%20meeting%202019.01.03/near/184743232" class="zl"><img src="https://rust-lang.github.io/zulip_archive/assets/img/zulip.svg" alt="view this post on Zulip" style="width:20px;height:20px;"></a> nikomatsakis <a href="https://rust-lang.github.io/zulip_archive/stream/131828-t-compiler/topic/planning.20meeting.202019.2E01.2E03.html#184743232">(Jan 03 2020 at 15:44)</a>:</h4>
<p>yeah, that seems right</p>



<a name="184743235"></a>
<h4><a href="https://rust-lang.zulipchat.com#narrow/stream/131828-t-compiler/topic/planning%20meeting%202019.01.03/near/184743235" class="zl"><img src="https://rust-lang.github.io/zulip_archive/assets/img/zulip.svg" alt="view this post on Zulip" style="width:20px;height:20px;"></a> pnkfelix <a href="https://rust-lang.github.io/zulip_archive/stream/131828-t-compiler/topic/planning.20meeting.202019.2E01.2E03.html#184743235">(Jan 03 2020 at 15:44)</a>:</h4>
<p>and let Jan 17th stand as a new planning meeting</p>



<a name="184743237"></a>
<h4><a href="https://rust-lang.zulipchat.com#narrow/stream/131828-t-compiler/topic/planning%20meeting%202019.01.03/near/184743237" class="zl"><img src="https://rust-lang.github.io/zulip_archive/assets/img/zulip.svg" alt="view this post on Zulip" style="width:20px;height:20px;"></a> nikomatsakis <a href="https://rust-lang.github.io/zulip_archive/stream/131828-t-compiler/topic/planning.20meeting.202019.2E01.2E03.html#184743237">(Jan 03 2020 at 15:44)</a>:</h4>
<p>seems fine to me</p>



<a name="184743245"></a>
<h4><a href="https://rust-lang.zulipchat.com#narrow/stream/131828-t-compiler/topic/planning%20meeting%202019.01.03/near/184743245" class="zl"><img src="https://rust-lang.github.io/zulip_archive/assets/img/zulip.svg" alt="view this post on Zulip" style="width:20px;height:20px;"></a> mw <a href="https://rust-lang.github.io/zulip_archive/stream/131828-t-compiler/topic/planning.20meeting.202019.2E01.2E03.html#184743245">(Jan 03 2020 at 15:44)</a>:</h4>
<blockquote>
<p>crate structure, splitting things into traits, having something like traits that get further and further refined</p>
</blockquote>
<p>(salsa has some good lessons there too probably)</p>



<a name="184743375"></a>
<h4><a href="https://rust-lang.zulipchat.com#narrow/stream/131828-t-compiler/topic/planning%20meeting%202019.01.03/near/184743375" class="zl"><img src="https://rust-lang.github.io/zulip_archive/assets/img/zulip.svg" alt="view this post on Zulip" style="width:20px;height:20px;"></a> nikomatsakis <a href="https://rust-lang.github.io/zulip_archive/stream/131828-t-compiler/topic/planning.20meeting.202019.2E01.2E03.html#184743375">(Jan 03 2020 at 15:46)</a>:</h4>
<p>Yeah, I need to sync up some with <span class="user-mention" data-user-id="133169">@matklad</span> on that topic too, since we were debating in rust-analyzer a lot about this.</p>



<a name="184743405"></a>
<h4><a href="https://rust-lang.zulipchat.com#narrow/stream/131828-t-compiler/topic/planning%20meeting%202019.01.03/near/184743405" class="zl"><img src="https://rust-lang.github.io/zulip_archive/assets/img/zulip.svg" alt="view this post on Zulip" style="width:20px;height:20px;"></a> nikomatsakis <a href="https://rust-lang.github.io/zulip_archive/stream/131828-t-compiler/topic/planning.20meeting.202019.2E01.2E03.html#184743405">(Jan 03 2020 at 15:46)</a>:</h4>
<p>(Separately, I have to say I am pretty loathe to try and move chalk into the rust-lang/rust repo, although I recognize some of the "monorepo" advantages too.)</p>



<a name="184743409"></a>
<h4><a href="https://rust-lang.zulipchat.com#narrow/stream/131828-t-compiler/topic/planning%20meeting%202019.01.03/near/184743409" class="zl"><img src="https://rust-lang.github.io/zulip_archive/assets/img/zulip.svg" alt="view this post on Zulip" style="width:20px;height:20px;"></a> centril <a href="https://rust-lang.github.io/zulip_archive/stream/131828-t-compiler/topic/planning.20meeting.202019.2E01.2E03.html#184743409">(Jan 03 2020 at 15:46)</a>:</h4>
<p>btw, if we have a sec over, I'd like to flag <a href="https://github.com/rust-lang/rust/pull/67833" target="_blank" title="https://github.com/rust-lang/rust/pull/67833">https://github.com/rust-lang/rust/pull/67833</a> as in possible need of some team discussion</p>



<a name="184743446"></a>
<h4><a href="https://rust-lang.zulipchat.com#narrow/stream/131828-t-compiler/topic/planning%20meeting%202019.01.03/near/184743446" class="zl"><img src="https://rust-lang.github.io/zulip_archive/assets/img/zulip.svg" alt="view this post on Zulip" style="width:20px;height:20px;"></a> nikomatsakis <a href="https://rust-lang.github.io/zulip_archive/stream/131828-t-compiler/topic/planning.20meeting.202019.2E01.2E03.html#184743446">(Jan 03 2020 at 15:47)</a>:</h4>
<blockquote>
<p>Fix some of the rustfmt fallout in Miri <a href="https://github.com/rust-lang/rust/issues/67833" target="_blank" title="https://github.com/rust-lang/rust/issues/67833">#67833</a></p>
</blockquote>



<a name="184743468"></a>
<h4><a href="https://rust-lang.zulipchat.com#narrow/stream/131828-t-compiler/topic/planning%20meeting%202019.01.03/near/184743468" class="zl"><img src="https://rust-lang.github.io/zulip_archive/assets/img/zulip.svg" alt="view this post on Zulip" style="width:20px;height:20px;"></a> centril <a href="https://rust-lang.github.io/zulip_archive/stream/131828-t-compiler/topic/planning.20meeting.202019.2E01.2E03.html#184743468">(Jan 03 2020 at 15:47)</a>:</h4>
<p>(cc <span class="user-mention" data-user-id="120791">@RalfJ</span>)</p>



<a name="184743564"></a>
<h4><a href="https://rust-lang.zulipchat.com#narrow/stream/131828-t-compiler/topic/planning%20meeting%202019.01.03/near/184743564" class="zl"><img src="https://rust-lang.github.io/zulip_archive/assets/img/zulip.svg" alt="view this post on Zulip" style="width:20px;height:20px;"></a> pnkfelix <a href="https://rust-lang.github.io/zulip_archive/stream/131828-t-compiler/topic/planning.20meeting.202019.2E01.2E03.html#184743564">(Jan 03 2020 at 15:48)</a>:</h4>
<p>out of curiousity regarding the match arm formatting of <code>PAT =&gt; macro!(&lt;newline-yuck&gt;</code></p>



<a name="184743574"></a>
<h4><a href="https://rust-lang.zulipchat.com#narrow/stream/131828-t-compiler/topic/planning%20meeting%202019.01.03/near/184743574" class="zl"><img src="https://rust-lang.github.io/zulip_archive/assets/img/zulip.svg" alt="view this post on Zulip" style="width:20px;height:20px;"></a> pnkfelix <a href="https://rust-lang.github.io/zulip_archive/stream/131828-t-compiler/topic/planning.20meeting.202019.2E01.2E03.html#184743574">(Jan 03 2020 at 15:48)</a>:</h4>
<p>does that get "resolved" if you add <code>{ } </code> to the RHS of the ARM ?</p>



<a name="184743575"></a>
<h4><a href="https://rust-lang.zulipchat.com#narrow/stream/131828-t-compiler/topic/planning%20meeting%202019.01.03/near/184743575" class="zl"><img src="https://rust-lang.github.io/zulip_archive/assets/img/zulip.svg" alt="view this post on Zulip" style="width:20px;height:20px;"></a> nikomatsakis <a href="https://rust-lang.github.io/zulip_archive/stream/131828-t-compiler/topic/planning.20meeting.202019.2E01.2E03.html#184743575">(Jan 03 2020 at 15:48)</a>:</h4>
<p>I think I agree with you <span class="user-mention" data-user-id="126931">@centril</span> that I'd prefer to avoid <code>#[rustfmt::skip]</code>.</p>



<a name="184743596"></a>
<h4><a href="https://rust-lang.zulipchat.com#narrow/stream/131828-t-compiler/topic/planning%20meeting%202019.01.03/near/184743596" class="zl"><img src="https://rust-lang.github.io/zulip_archive/assets/img/zulip.svg" alt="view this post on Zulip" style="width:20px;height:20px;"></a> nikomatsakis <a href="https://rust-lang.github.io/zulip_archive/stream/131828-t-compiler/topic/planning.20meeting.202019.2E01.2E03.html#184743596">(Jan 03 2020 at 15:49)</a>:</h4>
<blockquote>
<p>does that get "resolved" if you add <code>{ } </code> to the RHS of the ARM ?</p>
</blockquote>
<p>probably not, I thnk rustfmt tends to normalize those away,  but I'm not sure about this particular case</p>



<a name="184743613"></a>
<h4><a href="https://rust-lang.zulipchat.com#narrow/stream/131828-t-compiler/topic/planning%20meeting%202019.01.03/near/184743613" class="zl"><img src="https://rust-lang.github.io/zulip_archive/assets/img/zulip.svg" alt="view this post on Zulip" style="width:20px;height:20px;"></a> pnkfelix <a href="https://rust-lang.github.io/zulip_archive/stream/131828-t-compiler/topic/planning.20meeting.202019.2E01.2E03.html#184743613">(Jan 03 2020 at 15:49)</a>:</h4>
<p>That's interesting, I didn't know that</p>



<a name="184743716"></a>
<h4><a href="https://rust-lang.zulipchat.com#narrow/stream/131828-t-compiler/topic/planning%20meeting%202019.01.03/near/184743716" class="zl"><img src="https://rust-lang.github.io/zulip_archive/assets/img/zulip.svg" alt="view this post on Zulip" style="width:20px;height:20px;"></a> centril <a href="https://rust-lang.github.io/zulip_archive/stream/131828-t-compiler/topic/planning.20meeting.202019.2E01.2E03.html#184743716">(Jan 03 2020 at 15:50)</a>:</h4>
<p>(Though I'm personally open to adding minor tweaks to <code>rustfmt.toml</code> because it's global; for me it's most important that format-on-save "just works" and that we collectively can stop thinking about style)</p>



<a name="184743722"></a>
<h4><a href="https://rust-lang.zulipchat.com#narrow/stream/131828-t-compiler/topic/planning%20meeting%202019.01.03/near/184743722" class="zl"><img src="https://rust-lang.github.io/zulip_archive/assets/img/zulip.svg" alt="view this post on Zulip" style="width:20px;height:20px;"></a> pnkfelix <a href="https://rust-lang.github.io/zulip_archive/stream/131828-t-compiler/topic/planning.20meeting.202019.2E01.2E03.html#184743722">(Jan 03 2020 at 15:50)</a>:</h4>
<p>maybe <span class="user-mention" data-user-id="120791">@RalfJ</span> should just write it as <code>write!(f, match self { ... })</code> . (Only half joking...)</p>



<a name="184743760"></a>
<h4><a href="https://rust-lang.zulipchat.com#narrow/stream/131828-t-compiler/topic/planning%20meeting%202019.01.03/near/184743760" class="zl"><img src="https://rust-lang.github.io/zulip_archive/assets/img/zulip.svg" alt="view this post on Zulip" style="width:20px;height:20px;"></a> nikomatsakis <a href="https://rust-lang.github.io/zulip_archive/stream/131828-t-compiler/topic/planning.20meeting.202019.2E01.2E03.html#184743760">(Jan 03 2020 at 15:51)</a>:</h4>
<p>e.g. try <a href="https://play.rust-lang.org/?version=stable&amp;mode=debug&amp;edition=2018&amp;gist=2c14ee5f52a8df9a0185685392659d52" target="_blank" title="https://play.rust-lang.org/?version=stable&amp;mode=debug&amp;edition=2018&amp;gist=2c14ee5f52a8df9a0185685392659d52">formatting this example</a></p>



<a name="184743875"></a>
<h4><a href="https://rust-lang.zulipchat.com#narrow/stream/131828-t-compiler/topic/planning%20meeting%202019.01.03/near/184743875" class="zl"><img src="https://rust-lang.github.io/zulip_archive/assets/img/zulip.svg" alt="view this post on Zulip" style="width:20px;height:20px;"></a> nikomatsakis <a href="https://rust-lang.github.io/zulip_archive/stream/131828-t-compiler/topic/planning.20meeting.202019.2E01.2E03.html#184743875">(Jan 03 2020 at 15:52)</a>:</h4>
<blockquote>
<p>(Though I'm personally open to adding minor tweaks to <code>rustfmt.toml</code> because it's global; for me it's most important that format-on-save "just works" and that we collectively can stop thinking about style)</p>
</blockquote>
<p>this seems like the key thing to be discussing, right?</p>



<a name="184743893"></a>
<h4><a href="https://rust-lang.zulipchat.com#narrow/stream/131828-t-compiler/topic/planning%20meeting%202019.01.03/near/184743893" class="zl"><img src="https://rust-lang.github.io/zulip_archive/assets/img/zulip.svg" alt="view this post on Zulip" style="width:20px;height:20px;"></a> pnkfelix <a href="https://rust-lang.github.io/zulip_archive/stream/131828-t-compiler/topic/planning.20meeting.202019.2E01.2E03.html#184743893">(Jan 03 2020 at 15:52)</a>:</h4>
<p>this <a href="https://play.rust-lang.org/?version=stable&amp;mode=debug&amp;edition=2018&amp;gist=0028f698756c36b20c07770e4938f303" target="_blank" title="https://play.rust-lang.org/?version=stable&amp;mode=debug&amp;edition=2018&amp;gist=0028f698756c36b20c07770e4938f303">case</a> is fixed though</p>



<a name="184743906"></a>
<h4><a href="https://rust-lang.zulipchat.com#narrow/stream/131828-t-compiler/topic/planning%20meeting%202019.01.03/near/184743906" class="zl"><img src="https://rust-lang.github.io/zulip_archive/assets/img/zulip.svg" alt="view this post on Zulip" style="width:20px;height:20px;"></a> nikomatsakis <a href="https://rust-lang.github.io/zulip_archive/stream/131828-t-compiler/topic/planning.20meeting.202019.2E01.2E03.html#184743906">(Jan 03 2020 at 15:52)</a>:</h4>
<p>but perhaps not in <em>this meeting</em> exactly -- I guess the question is whether we need to raise this more broadly and where</p>



<a name="184743926"></a>
<h4><a href="https://rust-lang.zulipchat.com#narrow/stream/131828-t-compiler/topic/planning%20meeting%202019.01.03/near/184743926" class="zl"><img src="https://rust-lang.github.io/zulip_archive/assets/img/zulip.svg" alt="view this post on Zulip" style="width:20px;height:20px;"></a> nikomatsakis <a href="https://rust-lang.github.io/zulip_archive/stream/131828-t-compiler/topic/planning.20meeting.202019.2E01.2E03.html#184743926">(Jan 03 2020 at 15:53)</a>:</h4>
<blockquote>
<p>this <a href="https://play.rust-lang.org/?version=stable&amp;mode=debug&amp;edition=2018&amp;gist=0028f698756c36b20c07770e4938f303" target="_blank" title="https://play.rust-lang.org/?version=stable&amp;mode=debug&amp;edition=2018&amp;gist=0028f698756c36b20c07770e4938f303">case</a> is fixed though</p>
</blockquote>
<p>yeah I don't know the precise rules, maybe to do with <code>;</code>, not sure</p>



<a name="184743933"></a>
<h4><a href="https://rust-lang.zulipchat.com#narrow/stream/131828-t-compiler/topic/planning%20meeting%202019.01.03/near/184743933" class="zl"><img src="https://rust-lang.github.io/zulip_archive/assets/img/zulip.svg" alt="view this post on Zulip" style="width:20px;height:20px;"></a> centril <a href="https://rust-lang.github.io/zulip_archive/stream/131828-t-compiler/topic/planning.20meeting.202019.2E01.2E03.html#184743933">(Jan 03 2020 at 15:53)</a>:</h4>
<p>yea; I'm personally happy with the two tweaks we added to the <code>rustfmt.toml</code></p>



<a name="184743950"></a>
<h4><a href="https://rust-lang.zulipchat.com#narrow/stream/131828-t-compiler/topic/planning%20meeting%202019.01.03/near/184743950" class="zl"><img src="https://rust-lang.github.io/zulip_archive/assets/img/zulip.svg" alt="view this post on Zulip" style="width:20px;height:20px;"></a> centril <a href="https://rust-lang.github.io/zulip_archive/stream/131828-t-compiler/topic/planning.20meeting.202019.2E01.2E03.html#184743950">(Jan 03 2020 at 15:53)</a>:</h4>
<p>but we shouldn't grow a lot more</p>



<a name="184743984"></a>
<h4><a href="https://rust-lang.zulipchat.com#narrow/stream/131828-t-compiler/topic/planning%20meeting%202019.01.03/near/184743984" class="zl"><img src="https://rust-lang.github.io/zulip_archive/assets/img/zulip.svg" alt="view this post on Zulip" style="width:20px;height:20px;"></a> centril <a href="https://rust-lang.github.io/zulip_archive/stream/131828-t-compiler/topic/planning.20meeting.202019.2E01.2E03.html#184743984">(Jan 03 2020 at 15:53)</a>:</h4>
<p>(there's always lobbying for tweaks to the official standard style ^^)</p>



<a name="184744048"></a>
<h4><a href="https://rust-lang.zulipchat.com#narrow/stream/131828-t-compiler/topic/planning%20meeting%202019.01.03/near/184744048" class="zl"><img src="https://rust-lang.github.io/zulip_archive/assets/img/zulip.svg" alt="view this post on Zulip" style="width:20px;height:20px;"></a> nikomatsakis <a href="https://rust-lang.github.io/zulip_archive/stream/131828-t-compiler/topic/planning.20meeting.202019.2E01.2E03.html#184744048">(Jan 03 2020 at 15:54)</a>:</h4>
<p>(side note, I <em>do</em> think our match style can make it hard to separate the patterns from the arm bodies...)</p>



<a name="184744095"></a>
<h4><a href="https://rust-lang.zulipchat.com#narrow/stream/131828-t-compiler/topic/planning%20meeting%202019.01.03/near/184744095" class="zl"><img src="https://rust-lang.github.io/zulip_archive/assets/img/zulip.svg" alt="view this post on Zulip" style="width:20px;height:20px;"></a> pnkfelix <a href="https://rust-lang.github.io/zulip_archive/stream/131828-t-compiler/topic/planning.20meeting.202019.2E01.2E03.html#184744095">(Jan 03 2020 at 15:55)</a>:</h4>
<blockquote>
<blockquote>
<p>this <a href="https://play.rust-lang.org/?version=stable&amp;mode=debug&amp;edition=2018&amp;gist=0028f698756c36b20c07770e4938f303" target="_blank" title="https://play.rust-lang.org/?version=stable&amp;mode=debug&amp;edition=2018&amp;gist=0028f698756c36b20c07770e4938f303">case</a> is fixed though</p>
</blockquote>
<p>yeah I don't know the precise rules, maybe to do with <code>;</code>, not sure</p>
</blockquote>
<p>You're right, its because of the <code>;</code>. Still, seems like it would resolve <span class="user-mention" data-user-id="120791">@RalfJ</span> particular issue here</p>



<a name="184744121"></a>
<h4><a href="https://rust-lang.zulipchat.com#narrow/stream/131828-t-compiler/topic/planning%20meeting%202019.01.03/near/184744121" class="zl"><img src="https://rust-lang.github.io/zulip_archive/assets/img/zulip.svg" alt="view this post on Zulip" style="width:20px;height:20px;"></a> pnkfelix <a href="https://rust-lang.github.io/zulip_archive/stream/131828-t-compiler/topic/planning.20meeting.202019.2E01.2E03.html#184744121">(Jan 03 2020 at 15:55)</a>:</h4>
<p>or maybe not</p>



<a name="184744204"></a>
<h4><a href="https://rust-lang.zulipchat.com#narrow/stream/131828-t-compiler/topic/planning%20meeting%202019.01.03/near/184744204" class="zl"><img src="https://rust-lang.github.io/zulip_archive/assets/img/zulip.svg" alt="view this post on Zulip" style="width:20px;height:20px;"></a> pnkfelix <a href="https://rust-lang.github.io/zulip_archive/stream/131828-t-compiler/topic/planning.20meeting.202019.2E01.2E03.html#184744204">(Jan 03 2020 at 15:56)</a>:</h4>
<p>/me hasn't looked <em>too</em> carefully at the output <span class="user-mention" data-user-id="120791">@RalfJ</span> desires ...</p>



<a name="184744265"></a>
<h4><a href="https://rust-lang.zulipchat.com#narrow/stream/131828-t-compiler/topic/planning%20meeting%202019.01.03/near/184744265" class="zl"><img src="https://rust-lang.github.io/zulip_archive/assets/img/zulip.svg" alt="view this post on Zulip" style="width:20px;height:20px;"></a> pnkfelix <a href="https://rust-lang.github.io/zulip_archive/stream/131828-t-compiler/topic/planning.20meeting.202019.2E01.2E03.html#184744265">(Jan 03 2020 at 15:57)</a>:</h4>
<p>Anyway, is the question about whether we need to be gathering notes about these cases in some central place?</p>



<a name="184744272"></a>
<h4><a href="https://rust-lang.zulipchat.com#narrow/stream/131828-t-compiler/topic/planning%20meeting%202019.01.03/near/184744272" class="zl"><img src="https://rust-lang.github.io/zulip_archive/assets/img/zulip.svg" alt="view this post on Zulip" style="width:20px;height:20px;"></a> centril <a href="https://rust-lang.github.io/zulip_archive/stream/131828-t-compiler/topic/planning.20meeting.202019.2E01.2E03.html#184744272">(Jan 03 2020 at 15:57)</a>:</h4>
<p>I probably wasn't a big fan of the official style at first, but now everything else just looks wrong =P</p>



<a name="184744417"></a>
<h4><a href="https://rust-lang.zulipchat.com#narrow/stream/131828-t-compiler/topic/planning%20meeting%202019.01.03/near/184744417" class="zl"><img src="https://rust-lang.github.io/zulip_archive/assets/img/zulip.svg" alt="view this post on Zulip" style="width:20px;height:20px;"></a> pnkfelix <a href="https://rust-lang.github.io/zulip_archive/stream/131828-t-compiler/topic/planning.20meeting.202019.2E01.2E03.html#184744417">(Jan 03 2020 at 15:58)</a>:</h4>
<p>the reason that I agree with <span class="user-mention" data-user-id="120791">@RalfJ</span> in this case, is that the <code>write!</code> 's i the rustfmt'd output all appear at different column numbers</p>



<a name="184744428"></a>
<h4><a href="https://rust-lang.zulipchat.com#narrow/stream/131828-t-compiler/topic/planning%20meeting%202019.01.03/near/184744428" class="zl"><img src="https://rust-lang.github.io/zulip_archive/assets/img/zulip.svg" alt="view this post on Zulip" style="width:20px;height:20px;"></a> pnkfelix <a href="https://rust-lang.github.io/zulip_archive/stream/131828-t-compiler/topic/planning.20meeting.202019.2E01.2E03.html#184744428">(Jan 03 2020 at 15:58)</a>:</h4>
<p>while in <span class="user-mention" data-user-id="120791">@RalfJ</span> 's version, they all line up in a column</p>



<a name="184744480"></a>
<h4><a href="https://rust-lang.zulipchat.com#narrow/stream/131828-t-compiler/topic/planning%20meeting%202019.01.03/near/184744480" class="zl"><img src="https://rust-lang.github.io/zulip_archive/assets/img/zulip.svg" alt="view this post on Zulip" style="width:20px;height:20px;"></a> pnkfelix <a href="https://rust-lang.github.io/zulip_archive/stream/131828-t-compiler/topic/planning.20meeting.202019.2E01.2E03.html#184744480">(Jan 03 2020 at 15:59)</a>:</h4>
<p>maybe there is a tweak we could add for comma-delimited arms that would still preserve that property</p>



<a name="184744572"></a>
<h4><a href="https://rust-lang.zulipchat.com#narrow/stream/131828-t-compiler/topic/planning%20meeting%202019.01.03/near/184744572" class="zl"><img src="https://rust-lang.github.io/zulip_archive/assets/img/zulip.svg" alt="view this post on Zulip" style="width:20px;height:20px;"></a> centril <a href="https://rust-lang.github.io/zulip_archive/stream/131828-t-compiler/topic/planning.20meeting.202019.2E01.2E03.html#184744572">(Jan 03 2020 at 16:00)</a>:</h4>
<p>I agree Ralf's is probably somewhat nicer, but still, having uniform style is nicer still</p>



<a name="184744574"></a>
<h4><a href="https://rust-lang.zulipchat.com#narrow/stream/131828-t-compiler/topic/planning%20meeting%202019.01.03/near/184744574" class="zl"><img src="https://rust-lang.github.io/zulip_archive/assets/img/zulip.svg" alt="view this post on Zulip" style="width:20px;height:20px;"></a> mw <a href="https://rust-lang.github.io/zulip_archive/stream/131828-t-compiler/topic/planning.20meeting.202019.2E01.2E03.html#184744574">(Jan 03 2020 at 16:00)</a>:</h4>
<p>/me <span aria-label="wave" class="emoji emoji-1f44b" role="img" title="wave">:wave:</span></p>



<a name="184744637"></a>
<h4><a href="https://rust-lang.zulipchat.com#narrow/stream/131828-t-compiler/topic/planning%20meeting%202019.01.03/near/184744637" class="zl"><img src="https://rust-lang.github.io/zulip_archive/assets/img/zulip.svg" alt="view this post on Zulip" style="width:20px;height:20px;"></a> pnkfelix <a href="https://rust-lang.github.io/zulip_archive/stream/131828-t-compiler/topic/planning.20meeting.202019.2E01.2E03.html#184744637">(Jan 03 2020 at 16:00)</a>:</h4>
<blockquote>
<p>You're right, its because of the <code>;</code>. Still, seems like it would resolve <span class="user-mention silent" data-user-id="120791">RalfJ</span> particular issue here</p>
</blockquote>
<p>(when I said this, I had ignored the detail that the return value is of course relevant, since this returns <code>fmt::Result</code>. Its not as trivial as what I posted in that play link.)</p>



<a name="184744671"></a>
<h4><a href="https://rust-lang.zulipchat.com#narrow/stream/131828-t-compiler/topic/planning%20meeting%202019.01.03/near/184744671" class="zl"><img src="https://rust-lang.github.io/zulip_archive/assets/img/zulip.svg" alt="view this post on Zulip" style="width:20px;height:20px;"></a> pnkfelix <a href="https://rust-lang.github.io/zulip_archive/stream/131828-t-compiler/topic/planning.20meeting.202019.2E01.2E03.html#184744671">(Jan 03 2020 at 16:01)</a>:</h4>
<p>Okay <span class="user-group-mention" data-user-group-id="897">@T-compiler/meeting</span> , that's an hour. I gotta go and I infer <span class="user-mention" data-user-id="124287">@mw</span> had to go too. and I think <span class="user-mention" data-user-id="116009">@nikomatsakis</span> also said they had a hard out after the hour</p>



<a name="184744700"></a>
<h4><a href="https://rust-lang.zulipchat.com#narrow/stream/131828-t-compiler/topic/planning%20meeting%202019.01.03/near/184744700" class="zl"><img src="https://rust-lang.github.io/zulip_archive/assets/img/zulip.svg" alt="view this post on Zulip" style="width:20px;height:20px;"></a> centril <a href="https://rust-lang.github.io/zulip_archive/stream/131828-t-compiler/topic/planning.20meeting.202019.2E01.2E03.html#184744700">(Jan 03 2020 at 16:01)</a>:</h4>
<p>Thanks all</p>



<a name="184751796"></a>
<h4><a href="https://rust-lang.zulipchat.com#narrow/stream/131828-t-compiler/topic/planning%20meeting%202019.01.03/near/184751796" class="zl"><img src="https://rust-lang.github.io/zulip_archive/assets/img/zulip.svg" alt="view this post on Zulip" style="width:20px;height:20px;"></a> RalfJ <a href="https://rust-lang.github.io/zulip_archive/stream/131828-t-compiler/topic/planning.20meeting.202019.2E01.2E03.html#184751796">(Jan 03 2020 at 17:34)</a>:</h4>
<blockquote>
<p>I agree Ralf's is probably somewhat nicer, but still, having uniform style is nicer still</p>
</blockquote>
<p>So unform bad formatting is better than sometimes good formatting? I strongly disagree.<br>
If this was just "it's not perfect but okay", I' agree (and there are other things rustfmt does that fall under this), but what it does to long <code>match</code> is unacceptable IMO. It makes such code harder to work with, getting in the way of actual work on that code.</p>



<a name="184751858"></a>
<h4><a href="https://rust-lang.zulipchat.com#narrow/stream/131828-t-compiler/topic/planning%20meeting%202019.01.03/near/184751858" class="zl"><img src="https://rust-lang.github.io/zulip_archive/assets/img/zulip.svg" alt="view this post on Zulip" style="width:20px;height:20px;"></a> RalfJ <a href="https://rust-lang.github.io/zulip_archive/stream/131828-t-compiler/topic/planning.20meeting.202019.2E01.2E03.html#184751858">(Jan 03 2020 at 17:35)</a>:</h4>
<p>What rustfmt does to <code>match</code> is generally pretty bad IMO, and it gets worse long matches: those should be formatted uniformly, but rustfmt independently applies its rules on each arm, leading to something entirely non-uniform across the entire match</p>



<a name="184751946"></a>
<h4><a href="https://rust-lang.zulipchat.com#narrow/stream/131828-t-compiler/topic/planning%20meeting%202019.01.03/near/184751946" class="zl"><img src="https://rust-lang.github.io/zulip_archive/assets/img/zulip.svg" alt="view this post on Zulip" style="width:20px;height:20px;"></a> RalfJ <a href="https://rust-lang.github.io/zulip_archive/stream/131828-t-compiler/topic/planning.20meeting.202019.2E01.2E03.html#184751946">(Jan 03 2020 at 17:36)</a>:</h4>
<p>also see <a href="https://github.com/rust-lang/rustfmt/issues/3973" target="_blank" title="https://github.com/rust-lang/rustfmt/issues/3973">https://github.com/rust-lang/rustfmt/issues/3973</a> (rustfmt provides no way to format pattern alternatives in a way that all patterns start on the same column, and will destroy manual formatting if you had achieved that), and <a href="https://github.com/rust-lang/rustfmt/issues/3995" target="_blank" title="https://github.com/rust-lang/rustfmt/issues/3995">https://github.com/rust-lang/rustfmt/issues/3995</a></p>



<a name="184751975"></a>
<h4><a href="https://rust-lang.zulipchat.com#narrow/stream/131828-t-compiler/topic/planning%20meeting%202019.01.03/near/184751975" class="zl"><img src="https://rust-lang.github.io/zulip_archive/assets/img/zulip.svg" alt="view this post on Zulip" style="width:20px;height:20px;"></a> RalfJ <a href="https://rust-lang.github.io/zulip_archive/stream/131828-t-compiler/topic/planning.20meeting.202019.2E01.2E03.html#184751975">(Jan 03 2020 at 17:37)</a>:</h4>
<blockquote>
<p>(side note, I <em>do</em> think our match style can make it hard to separate the patterns from the arm bodies...)</p>
</blockquote>
<p>Yeah, that's pretty much the worst part about it IMO. Also see <a href="https://github.com/rust-lang/rustfmt/issues/3995#issuecomment-570557622" target="_blank" title="https://github.com/rust-lang/rustfmt/issues/3995#issuecomment-570557622">https://github.com/rust-lang/rustfmt/issues/3995#issuecomment-570557622</a></p>



<a name="184752064"></a>
<h4><a href="https://rust-lang.zulipchat.com#narrow/stream/131828-t-compiler/topic/planning%20meeting%202019.01.03/near/184752064" class="zl"><img src="https://rust-lang.github.io/zulip_archive/assets/img/zulip.svg" alt="view this post on Zulip" style="width:20px;height:20px;"></a> centril <a href="https://rust-lang.github.io/zulip_archive/stream/131828-t-compiler/topic/planning.20meeting.202019.2E01.2E03.html#184752064">(Jan 03 2020 at 17:38)</a>:</h4>
<blockquote>
<p>So unform bad formatting is better than sometimes good formatting? I strongly disagree.</p>
</blockquote>
<p><span class="user-mention" data-user-id="120791">@RalfJ</span>  pretty much yeah; although "bad style" is likely quite subjective wrt. formatting</p>



<a name="184752081"></a>
<h4><a href="https://rust-lang.zulipchat.com#narrow/stream/131828-t-compiler/topic/planning%20meeting%202019.01.03/near/184752081" class="zl"><img src="https://rust-lang.github.io/zulip_archive/assets/img/zulip.svg" alt="view this post on Zulip" style="width:20px;height:20px;"></a> RalfJ <a href="https://rust-lang.github.io/zulip_archive/stream/131828-t-compiler/topic/planning.20meeting.202019.2E01.2E03.html#184752081">(Jan 03 2020 at 17:38)</a>:</h4>
<p>yeah I appreciate everything about this is subjective :/</p>



<a name="184752116"></a>
<h4><a href="https://rust-lang.zulipchat.com#narrow/stream/131828-t-compiler/topic/planning%20meeting%202019.01.03/near/184752116" class="zl"><img src="https://rust-lang.github.io/zulip_archive/assets/img/zulip.svg" alt="view this post on Zulip" style="width:20px;height:20px;"></a> RalfJ <a href="https://rust-lang.github.io/zulip_archive/stream/131828-t-compiler/topic/planning.20meeting.202019.2E01.2E03.html#184752116">(Jan 03 2020 at 17:39)</a>:</h4>
<p>that's why I am latching on to uniformity as main topic, because that seems least controversial</p>



<a name="184752124"></a>
<h4><a href="https://rust-lang.zulipchat.com#narrow/stream/131828-t-compiler/topic/planning%20meeting%202019.01.03/near/184752124" class="zl"><img src="https://rust-lang.github.io/zulip_archive/assets/img/zulip.svg" alt="view this post on Zulip" style="width:20px;height:20px;"></a> RalfJ <a href="https://rust-lang.github.io/zulip_archive/stream/131828-t-compiler/topic/planning.20meeting.202019.2E01.2E03.html#184752124">(Jan 03 2020 at 17:39)</a>:</h4>
<p>what rustfmt does with large matches is the opposite of uniform</p>



<a name="184752128"></a>
<h4><a href="https://rust-lang.zulipchat.com#narrow/stream/131828-t-compiler/topic/planning%20meeting%202019.01.03/near/184752128" class="zl"><img src="https://rust-lang.github.io/zulip_archive/assets/img/zulip.svg" alt="view this post on Zulip" style="width:20px;height:20px;"></a> centril <a href="https://rust-lang.github.io/zulip_archive/stream/131828-t-compiler/topic/planning.20meeting.202019.2E01.2E03.html#184752128">(Jan 03 2020 at 17:39)</a>:</h4>
<p><span class="user-mention" data-user-id="120791">@RalfJ</span> I would be more comfortable if whatever tweaks you made were in rustfmt.toml though, unless we're talking rustfmt bugs</p>



<a name="184752161"></a>
<h4><a href="https://rust-lang.zulipchat.com#narrow/stream/131828-t-compiler/topic/planning%20meeting%202019.01.03/near/184752161" class="zl"><img src="https://rust-lang.github.io/zulip_archive/assets/img/zulip.svg" alt="view this post on Zulip" style="width:20px;height:20px;"></a> centril <a href="https://rust-lang.github.io/zulip_archive/stream/131828-t-compiler/topic/planning.20meeting.202019.2E01.2E03.html#184752161">(Jan 03 2020 at 17:39)</a>:</h4>
<p>(in which case I think bugs should be fixed upstream and then we can <code>./x.py fmt</code>)</p>



<a name="184752320"></a>
<h4><a href="https://rust-lang.zulipchat.com#narrow/stream/131828-t-compiler/topic/planning%20meeting%202019.01.03/near/184752320" class="zl"><img src="https://rust-lang.github.io/zulip_archive/assets/img/zulip.svg" alt="view this post on Zulip" style="width:20px;height:20px;"></a> RalfJ <a href="https://rust-lang.github.io/zulip_archive/stream/131828-t-compiler/topic/planning.20meeting.202019.2E01.2E03.html#184752320">(Jan 03 2020 at 17:41)</a>:</h4>
<p>sure it'd be better if rustfmt could do something reasonable on matches. I dont have the spare capacity to push for that though, I dont even know the process.<br>
more generally I feel like rustfmt could more often be a bit more respectful of the existing style, and not just tear everything apart. I'd be fine with it not doing a perfect job of formatting matches itself, which is hard, but I get mad when it destroys my carefully formatted matches. (I dont use rustfmt on my own projects, and that's the main reason.)</p>



<a name="184756999"></a>
<h4><a href="https://rust-lang.zulipchat.com#narrow/stream/131828-t-compiler/topic/planning%20meeting%202019.01.03/near/184756999" class="zl"><img src="https://rust-lang.github.io/zulip_archive/assets/img/zulip.svg" alt="view this post on Zulip" style="width:20px;height:20px;"></a> centril <a href="https://rust-lang.github.io/zulip_archive/stream/131828-t-compiler/topic/planning.20meeting.202019.2E01.2E03.html#184756999">(Jan 03 2020 at 18:43)</a>:</h4>
<p>Maybe there's an existing flag?</p>



<a name="184766056"></a>
<h4><a href="https://rust-lang.zulipchat.com#narrow/stream/131828-t-compiler/topic/planning%20meeting%202019.01.03/near/184766056" class="zl"><img src="https://rust-lang.github.io/zulip_archive/assets/img/zulip.svg" alt="view this post on Zulip" style="width:20px;height:20px;"></a> oli <a href="https://rust-lang.github.io/zulip_archive/stream/131828-t-compiler/topic/planning.20meeting.202019.2E01.2E03.html#184766056">(Jan 03 2020 at 20:41)</a>:</h4>
<p>That flag is called <code>#[rustfmt::skip]</code> <span aria-label="upside down" class="emoji emoji-1f643" role="img" title="upside down">:upside_down:</span></p>



<a name="184766175"></a>
<h4><a href="https://rust-lang.zulipchat.com#narrow/stream/131828-t-compiler/topic/planning%20meeting%202019.01.03/near/184766175" class="zl"><img src="https://rust-lang.github.io/zulip_archive/assets/img/zulip.svg" alt="view this post on Zulip" style="width:20px;height:20px;"></a> centril <a href="https://rust-lang.github.io/zulip_archive/stream/131828-t-compiler/topic/planning.20meeting.202019.2E01.2E03.html#184766175">(Jan 03 2020 at 20:43)</a>:</h4>
<p><span class="user-mention" data-user-id="124288">@oli</span> in rustfmt.toml, not files</p>



<hr><p>Last updated: Aug 07 2021 at 22:04 UTC</p>
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